DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, I just handed you two drives. Do you recognize those drives?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. The first one is marked Government Exhibit B. Do you recall discussing Government Exhibit B yesterday?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: And how do you -- strike that. What is on the drive at Government Exhibit B?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, it has messages and photos from my devices that I gave to the government.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. And you testified yesterday that you've reviewed the contents of Government Exhibit B, correct?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. And how do you know that you've reviewed the contents of Government Exhibit B?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I initialed it.
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, at this time the government is going to offer a number of exhibits, so I'll read the numbers into the record. It may take me just a moment.
THE COURT: Do you understand there to be any objections to the admission of these exhibits?
MS. JOHNSON: I do not believe so. That's why I just conferred with counsel on.
THE COURT: OK.
MS. JOHNSON: But counsel will double-check me.
(Counsel confer)
MS. JOHNSON: Yes, your Honor. The list is: B-210, B-211, B-212, B- 213, B- 217, B-218, B-221, B-225, B-226, B-227, B-229, B-231, B-232, B-233, B-235, B-236, B-243, B-245, B-247, B-248, B-251, B-253, B-254, B-255, B-256, B-257, B-258, (B-259, B-262, B-263, B-264, B-266, B-322, B-323, B-324, B-325, B-327, B-328, B-333, B-336, B-339, B-340, B-341, B-344, B-347, B-349, B-351, B-352, B-354, B-355, B-357, B-358, B-359, B-361, B-362, B-403, B-404, B-406, B-407. Sorry. And also B-405-A, B-410, B-412, and all subdivisions thereof. We would offer all those at this time.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MS. ESTEVAO: Can we just have one more moment, your Honor?
THE COURT: Yes.
MS. GERAGOS: 324 was already admitted, your Honor. The rest, we have no objection.
THE COURT: So those exhibits will be admitted.
MS. JOHNSON: Thank you, your Honor.
(Government's Exhibits B-210, B-211, B-212, B- 213, B- 217, B-218, B-221, B-225, B-226, B-227, B-229, B-231, B-232, B-233, B-235, B-236, B-243, B-245, B-247, B-248, B-251, B-253, B-254, B-255, B-256, B-257, B-258, B-259, B-262, B-263, B-264, B-266, B-322, B-323, B-325, B-327, B-328, B-333, B-336, B-339, B-340, B-341, B-344, B-347, B-349, B-351, B-352, B-354, B-355, B-357, B-358, B-359, B-361, B-362, B-403, B-404, B-406, B-407, B-405-A, B-410, B-412 and received in evidence)
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, I'm directing your attention now to the second drive that's in front of you that's marked Government Exhibit BX?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you recognize that drive?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: What is on that drive?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Similar content from my devices.
MS. JOHNSON: Have you reviewed the materials on that drive?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Does that drive also contain enhanced video images from the videos that were found on your devices?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. How do you know that what you reviewed is what's on that drive?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I've signed that I saw it.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you see your initial on the drive in front of you that's marked for identification as Government Exhibit BX?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: At this time, your Honor, the government is going to offer the Government Exhibit BX 201 through 210, including all subdivisions, and that includes offering, subject to connection, certain materials that will be authenticated by a later witness. Government Exhibit BX-601 to BX-602, including all subdivisions thereof.
THE COURT: Any objection?
MS. ESTEVAO: Subject to connection, no objection.
THE COURT: Those exhibits will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibits BX 201 through 210 and BX-601 and BX-602 received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Thank you, your Honor.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, you can put the drives aside now. Before we move on to before we left off yesterday, have you -- you testified yesterday that you used alias Jackie Star sometimes. Do you remember that testimony?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Are there any other aliases that you have used?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Personally? Veronica Bang was one I used for many years and Anita Crawford.
MS. JOHNSON: Just a few points I want to clarify from yesterday. Yesterday you testified about an incident that involved Suge Knight. Do you recall that testimony?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: And after D Rock came to the house that night, you testified that you saw him and Sean pack up?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um-hmm.
MS. JOHNSON: What did they pack up?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, well, they got dressed and quickly packed up guns that were in the safe, but they put them on their bodies.
MS. JOHNSON: Also yesterday, you testified that Sean wanted you to clarify if the escort was safe and not a cop. Do you recall that testimony?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Did Sean ask you once or more than once to confirm that an escort was not a cop?
CASANDRA VENTURA: More than once.
MS. JOHNSON: Approximately how many times did he ask you to confirm the escort was not a cop?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Over the whole relationship, roughly maybe, like, six to eight times. Not a lot.
MS. JOHNSON: Did he ever tell you to say anything in particular to the escort to make sure they were not a cop?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, I would lead with the fact that I wasn't a cop.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that something that Sean told you to say?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, when we broke yesterday, we were talking about the incident at the InterContinental. Do you remember that testimony?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yep.
MS. JOHNSON: During that testimony, you said that you did not fight back when Sean hit you. Were you speaking about the incident at the InterContinental that we were talking about, or were you speaking generally about incidents in your relationship?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was speaking specifically about the InterContinental.
MS. JOHNSON: And generally, in your relationship, were there times when you tried to fight back when Sean was violent with you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah. Yep.
MS. JOHNSON: What happened when you fought back?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did that more on the earlier side of the relationship. So I, um, I learned that it could escalate the fight more, make it worse for myself. Um, sometimes it would slow him down and he would stop. But, yeah, not usually.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say make it worse for yourself, what do you mean by that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, just make him more violent, make him stronger, want to push me harder in that situation.
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection to the specification as to the state of mind.
THE COURT: That's overruled.
MS. JOHNSON: How did you observe Sean react when you fought back?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, it varied. It usually could be anywhere from him just being surprised that I was actually fighting back, so shock, um, and more anger, more frustration is what I saw.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, could you please pull up and publish what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 10C-103. The timestamp one minute and 43 seconds.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, picking up where we left off yesterday, do you recognize what's depicted in Government Exhibit 10C-103 at timestamp one minute and 43 seconds?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes. That's the InterContinental Century City in LA.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. And who, if anyone, is depicted at this timestamp?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I am, in the corner.
MS. JOHNSON: In the bottom left-hand corner of the screen?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yep, and in the mirror.
MS. JOHNSON: And where is the mirror in this image?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Across from me, down the hall.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you play from 1:43 to 1:46, please.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: Who entered the elevator lobby during that clip, Ms. Ventura?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, is in his hands?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It doesn't appear to have anything in his hands.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please play to 1:59.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, are you able to tell from this pause if Sean has anything in his hands at one minute 59?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah. It looks like a phone that's lit up, I think.
MS. JOHNSON: Whose phone is in his hands?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I think that's my phone. Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: How did Sean get your phone?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Well, he took all my stuff, so ...
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can we please play to a minute stamp two minutes, ten seconds.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: Where does Sean initially head in that clip, in what direction?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It likes like he heads towards the room.
MS. JOHNSON: And where does he end up at the end of the clip?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sitting in a chair across from the mirrors by the window.
MS. JOHNSON: And are you visible in this particular timestamp?
CASANDRA VENTURA: No, not in the timestamp.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. Where are you relative to Sean right now?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I am, if you're looking at the screen, on the left, just behind the wall.
MS. JOHNSON: Directing your attention to the area of the video where Sean is sitting that's visible in the mirror --
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please play until 2:14.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what, if anything, is Sean recorded throwing in that clip?
CASANDRA VENTURA: There was a vase with flowers in it.
MS. JOHNSON: And what do you recall about what happened with Sean throwing the vase with flowers in it?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, I just remember it coming towards me. Um, I didn't get hit. I remember it hitting the wall. Um, but he was just yelling at me and threw it at me.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say he was yelling at you, what, if anything, was he saying to you during the events depicted on this video?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, I -- I don't remember exactly, like, his words, word for word, but I'm sure he was calling me out of my name.
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection to speculation.
THE COURT: That's sustained. Jury should disregard the witness's last answer.
MS. JOHNSON: Let's play until the end of the video.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: You can pause there, Ms. Gavin.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what are you doing with your arm in that clip?
CASANDRA VENTURA: At the end, I'm putting it up, and I'm backing away from him when he's walking towards me.
MS. JOHNSON: And you can play the last few seconds, Ms. Gavin.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: OK. You can take that down. If you can pull up Government Exhibit 10C-104, which is in evidence. Go to timestamp three minutes and 20 seconds.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, again, which direction are we looking at in this view of the hallway?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's the hallway that goes to the room we were staying in and the elevator is on the right.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. Ms. Gavin, can you, please, can you play a few frames. And pause again.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: Pause there.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who do you recognize in this image at three minutes and 21 seconds?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and security from the hotel.
MS. JOHNSON: In which direction are you walking?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Opposite of the room.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you jump forward to five minutes, 20 seconds.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: Can you play from five minutes 20 seconds to five minutes, 31 seconds.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: In which direction are you headed now?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Towards the room.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, do you have in your hands?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't see anything yet. Did I have my phone yet?
MS. JOHNSON: Let's jump ahead to six minutes -- minute six and 15 seconds. Ms. Gavin, can you play 6:15 to 6:25.
(Video played)
MS. JOHNSON: In which direction are you walking in that clip?
CASANDRA VENTURA: To the elevator.
MS. JOHNSON: Where are you walking from?
CASANDRA VENTURA: From the room.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, are you holding in your hands?
CASANDRA VENTURA: My bag and my purse.
MS. JOHNSON: Without guessing as to what Sean might have said, during this incident with Sean and the elevator lobby, was Sean speaking to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, do you remember about the substance of what he was saying to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That I wasn't going to leave him there. Yeah, that I couldn't.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, you can take that down.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, were you eventually able to leave the InterContinental Hotel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Where did you go once you left?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I went to my apartment that was close by.
MS. JOHNSON: Which apartment were you living at, at this time?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That was 875 Comstock.
MS. JOHNSON: How did you get from the hotel to your apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I took an Uber.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin -- Your Honor, may I have one moment to confer with defense counsel?
THE COURT: You may.
(Counsel confer)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, could you pull up, for identification only, for the parties and the court, Government Exhibit B-626. If you could put the first page, page one and page two, side by side, please.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize what this document is?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: What is it?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's a text message between me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And how do you recognize it?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, our names and phone numbers on it.
MS. JOHNSON: Is this a true and accurate text message between you and Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: The government offers Government Exhibit B-626?
MS. ESTEVAO: One moment, please, your Honor. No objection.
THE COURT: All right. This exhibit will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibit B-626 received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please publish the exhibit to the jury.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to the first page on the left, who are the participants in this chat?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. Ms. Gavin, can you please put pages two and three, side by side. If you could blow up the first message on page two.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what's the day and time that this message is sent?
CASANDRA VENTURA: March 5, 2016.
MS. JOHNSON: And who sent this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: This is from Sean to me.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you please read this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Call me.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you take that down, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: And, Ms. Ventura, can you read all the messages on page three?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yo. PLS call me. I got six kids. PLS call me.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you turn to pages four and five.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, can you please read all the messages on page four.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yo, PLS call. I'm surrounded. I'm sorry. Call me. For my kids, help.
MS. JOHNSON: On page five on the right, directing your attention to the top green message, who sends that message?
MS. JOHNSON: What is your response?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Put the robe on.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you tell Sean to put the robe on?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because he was running around in a towel and I was just looking out.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you continue reading the messages in blue?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It says, Call me. And then, Call now.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent those messages to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: From Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you turn to page six, please.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, page six, which is on right-hand side of your screen.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you blow up the green messages, please.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent these green messages?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you read your response?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I went and checked everything and spoke to security. Jules left so you're good and as long as you don't disturb the other guests, they'll leave you be. Peace.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, can you remind the jury who Jules is?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jules was one of the regular escorts that we used for freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: Was Jules present at the InterContinental Hotel on March 5, 2016?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: And where, if you know, was Jules during the incident that was depicted on the videos that we watched?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jules was inside of the hotel room.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you take this down, Ms. Gavin, and please put up Government Exhibit 2A-630 in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, yesterday you identified this individual as Jules. Is this the same Jules you were just talking about?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. What, if any, communications did you have with Jules after you left the InterContinental that day in an Uber?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I actually don't remember having any conversation with him after, um, until there was, like, another freak-off, honestly.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit B-606 and B-607, side by side, which are both in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what's depicted in Government Exhibit B-606 and B-607?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's me just a selfie of my fat lip, wearing sunglasses.
MS. JOHNSON: When was this image taken?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was taken in the Uber on the way to my apartment.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. After you left the InterContinental Hotel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: With what device did you take this photograph?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I took it with one of my phones.
MS. JOHNSON: And why are you wearing sunglasses in this photograph?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I had a black eye underneath. I was trying to cover it.
MS. JOHNSON: And what injury, other injuries, if any, can you see in these images?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just my fat lip.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin. Can you please pull up Government Exhibit 626 in evidence, pages six and seven, side by side.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention, we previously looked at the two green bubbles at the top of the screen. Directing your attention to the blue bubble underneath it on the left-hand side. Who sent this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean to me.
MS. JOHNSON: What does it say?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Call me now.
MS. JOHNSON: And, Ms. Gavin, can you enlarge the messages on page seven, please.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, can you read these messages?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Call me. The cops are here. You're going to abandon me all alone. Call me PLS.
MS. JOHNSON: When Sean said to you, on the top message, call me, the cops are here, what was your reaction?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't know. I don't think I really cared in that moment. Um, I just wanted to be home. Get away.
MS. JOHNSON: Are you aware either way if police showed up to the InterContinental Hotel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: No, I'm not.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please turn to pages eight and nine. If you could blow up the top two green bubbles.
MS. JOHNSON: So, after the messages we just read where Sean says, Call me, the cops are here, how do you respond?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I say, I have a premiere Monday for the biggest thing I've ever done in my life. I have a black eye and a fat lip. It was time for me to go. You are sick for thinking it's OK to do what you've done. Please stay far away from me.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you take that down.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, can you read the rest of the blue bubbles?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yep. Call me. Help. I'm about to be arrested. Thanks.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent you those messages?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please turn to the next two pages.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, can you pick up reading Sean's messages on these -- the blue bubbles on these pages?
CASANDRA VENTURA: If you don't pick up, you'll never hear my voice again. Damn. I would never ignore your calls. Call now. PLS. PLS.
MS. JOHNSON: Then the top message on this page?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I'm getting arrested.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, are you aware if Sean was arrested for this incident?
CASANDRA VENTURA: No, I -- I don't know. I don't think so.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. And how do you respond to his message I'm getting arrested?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Plugging my phone in and going to bed. You should do the same.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, you testified earlier that you left the InterContinental in an Uber to go to your apartment, is that right?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Who, if anyone, was at your apartment when you arrived home?
CASANDRA VENTURA: My friend, Kerry Morgan, was there.
MS. JOHNSON: How did Kerry react when she saw you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: She was super upset. She had seen me with black eyes and busted lips before, so she was pretty upset and she wanted to call the cops.
MS. JOHNSON: Are you aware if Ms. Morgan did call the police?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I am. She did.
MS. JOHNSON: How are you aware of that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because she called them in front of me and they came.
MS. JOHNSON: You mentioned the police came to your apartment, is that right?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um-hmm.
MS. JOHNSON: What interaction, if any, did you have with the police at your apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I answered a couple of questions. Um, but when they wanted me to say who I was talking about, I would not. So they left.
MS. JOHNSON: Why would you not say who you were talking about?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just, in that moment, didn't want to hurt him that way. Um, just too much going on. It was a lot for me in that moment and I didn't want to -- I wasn't ready.
MS. JOHNSON: And who were you talking about whose name you would not disclose?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to protect Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, of course.
MS. JOHNSON: After you returned to your apartment on March 5, 2016, who else, if anyone, tried to come over to your apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean did.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, do you recall about that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't know how he got there, but this was the apartment where I lived on the 17th floor, so he was just trying to get in and get to me and --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, can I ask a clarifying question?
THE COURT: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, how do you know Sean was trying to get into the apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I was notified by his assistant.
MS. JOHNSON: Who told you Sean was trying to get into your apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Well, Kerry because she was there and Kristina Khorram.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, could you hear while this was happening?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just chaos outside of the door, banging, kicking, yelling.
MS. JOHNSON: Could you hear Sean's voice?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: And where was his voice relevant to your apartment, where was his voice coming from relative to your apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Outside of the apartment door.
MS. JOHNSON: Was Sean able to get inside your apartment on March 5, 2016, after the incident at the InterContinental?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was not.
MS. JOHNSON: And can you describe how the noises outside your door sounded?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Him trying to -- well, yelling, um, again, banging. It was pretty normal. Um, just commotion in a very private building.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say banging, what, if anything --
CASANDRA VENTURA: On the door, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. So you heard banging on your front door?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: You also mentioned you heard from Sean's assistant that day?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Was that Ms. Khorram?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Besides Ms. Khorram, what, if any, contact did you have with any other employees of Sean's that day?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I spoke to D Rock. We ended up going to his house later on that day.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you remind me what role D Rock has?
CASANDRA VENTURA: D Rock was a security and a close friend.
MS. JOHNSON: You mentioned you went to D Rock's house later that day. Can you explain to the jury why you went to D Rock's house?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, well, living in LA, I really didn't have a whole lot of people, especially family. And D Rock and his wife were just always there for me, so I ended up going over there to feel safe. Tried to.
MS. JOHNSON: How long did Ms. Morgan stay with you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: She got on a flight back to New York that evening. Um, and by the time I got to the apartment, it was, like, afternoon, maybe like 2:00 o'clock, so...
MS. JOHNSON: When did you see Sean next?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I saw him next when he came to D Rock's house at the end of that night. We had been texting.
MS. JOHNSON: And where did you go over D Rock's house?
CASANDRA VENTURA: After D Rock's house, I went to Sean's house, and I did a fitting for the movie.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you pull up for identification only for the parties and counsel Government Exhibit B-627-A.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize who is depicted in Government Exhibit B-627-A?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah. That's me in Sean's bedroom in LA.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you recognize this?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's what I wore to the premiere.
MS. JOHNSON: Is this a true and accurate photograph of you in Sean's bedroom?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Government offers Government Exhibit B-627-A.
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: The government will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibit B-627-A received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, please publish that exhibit to the jury.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what are you wearing in this photo?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I'm wearing a gown and sunglasses.
MS. JOHNSON: Why are you wearing sunglasses?
CASANDRA VENTURA: To cover up my eye.
MS. JOHNSON: What had happened to your eye?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I got hit in the face, so I had a black eye.
MS. JOHNSON: And where was this photograph taken?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Inside of Sean's bedroom on Mapleton Drive.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, when you were talking about Sean trying to get into your apartment after the incident at the InterContinental, you described banging and yelling as normal. What did you mean by normal?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He showed up unannounced quite a bit when my friends were there. And when he did, it was a similar thing. If he doesn't have a key, he would just be trying to get inside.
MS. JOHNSON: What do you mean by similar thing?
CASANDRA VENTURA: An incident where he was angry, coming from somewhere being angry.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up and publish what's in evidence as Government Exhibit B-604.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what, if any, visible injuries did you have on the day of your premiere?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Visible, I had bruises on my body that weren't completely covered by the makeup. Um, I had quite a bit of makeup on, on my face.
MS. JOHNSON: Where is this particular image, Government Exhibit B-604, taken?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's at the beginning of the premiere of the movie that I was doing.
MS. JOHNSON: And you mentioned you had quite a bit of makeup on?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um-hmm.
MS. JOHNSON: What was the makeup covering?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The makeup was covering a bruising on my face.
MS. JOHNSON: You mentioned other bruising.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you zoom in on Ms. Ventura's shoulder.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if any, other bruising was visible?
CASANDRA VENTURA: You're referencing this. I had several bruises on my legs, but I changed into a different outfit.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin. Can you pull up Government Exhibit 9Q-101 for identification for the court and parties only.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize who is depicted in this exhibit?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yep. That's me and Sean at the after-party for the premiere.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you recognize this picture?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because we were together for a minute. I remember it.
MS. JOHNSON: And is this a fair and accurate photograph of you and Sean at the after-party for the premiere?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: The government offers Government Exhibit 9Q-101.
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: It will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibit 9Q-101 received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please publish this exhibit to the jury.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, you had mentioned a moment ago that you had changed dresses during the evening, is that right?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes?
MS. JOHNSON: What dress is this that you're wearing?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's the after-party dress that I changed into in, like, a popcorn closet at the movie theater. Yeah, my second dress.
MS. JOHNSON: And you mentioned earlier that what, if any, bruises were visible on your legs in this dress?
CASANDRA VENTURA: You can see one of them there, but I had a larger one on my thigh, my upper thigh, and I had another one somewhere around my shin, calf muscle.
MS. JOHNSON: Which bruise can you see in this photo? Can you --
CASANDRA VENTURA: I can see it on my right shin.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, next to you on the witness stand is a binder. Can you please look through the photos in that binder, all of them, and let me know who you recognize the photographs to be?
CASANDRA VENTURA: OK. OK.
MS. JOHNSON: Have you finished looking at the binder?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Who do you recognize those photographs to be depicting?
CASANDRA VENTURA: These are escorts that we used for freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: And are those true and accurate photos of escorts that you used for freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, the government offers Government Exhibit 2A-617, 2A-602, 2A-619, 2A-616, 2A-634, 2A-607, 2A-618, 2A-601, 2A-620, 2A-624, 2A-632, 2A-633, 2A-628.
THE COURT: Any objections?
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: Those exhibits will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibits 2A-617, 2A-602, 2A-619, 2A-616, 2A-634, 2A-607, 2A-618, 2A-601, 2A-620, 2A-624, 2A-632, 2A-633, 2A-628 received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up what is in evidence as Government Exhibit 2A-617.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-617 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Ash.
MS. JOHNSON: How did you hire Ash?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Ash was hired through Garren at Cowboys4Angels.
MS. JOHNSON: And in what cities did you and Sean use Ash?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We saw him in LA, maybe Vegas, and Ibiza.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, you can take this down. Can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-602 that's in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, how do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-602?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was an escort that we hired through Garren, I believe.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you know his name?
MS. JOHNSON: And in what cities did you see this escort?
CASANDRA VENTURA: New York.
MS. JOHNSON: Take that down, Ms. Gavin. Can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-619 in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in 2A-619 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Islander.
MS. JOHNSON: And how do you know Islander?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was hired for freak-offs, and I think he was on the site Latin men.
MS. JOHNSON: And in what cities was Islander hired, city or cities was Islander hired for freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Mostly LA.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there any other cities, if you remember?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Maybe Vegas. I'm not sure.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin. Can you please pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 2A-616.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in this exhibit as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I know him as Tommy, and he was hired by Garren. In Miami, I believe.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now. Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-634 in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-634 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I can't remember his name, but I know that he came through Garren, as well.
MS. JOHNSON: In what cities was this escort used?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Mainly, Los Angeles, I think. Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say mainly Los Angeles, do you recall any other cities?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Possibly we flew him out to another place. I'm not 100 percent sure.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now. Ms. Gavin, you can pull up Government Exhibit 2A-607 in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: What do you know the individual depicted in this exhibit as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I know him as Skyler.
MS. JOHNSON: And how do you know Skyler?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Through at Cowboys4Angels.
MS. JOHNSON: In what cities did you use Skyler?
MS. JOHNSON: Can you take that down now? Can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-618.
MS. JOHNSON: What do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-618 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jake.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you know Jake?
CASANDRA VENTURA: From Garren at Cowboys4Angels.
MS. JOHNSON: In what cities did you see Jake?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Los Angeles.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now. Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-601.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-601 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't know his name.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you recognize him despite not knowing his name?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes, vaguely.
MS. JOHNSON: What do you recognize him to be?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Somebody that Garren sent.
MS. JOHNSON: In what city did Garren send this individual?
MS. JOHNSON: Can you take that down now Ms. Gavin. Can you pull up Government Exhibit 2A-620.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-620 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I know him as Greg.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. And how did you know Greg?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was hired as an escort in Miami for freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now.
MS. JOHNSON: Are you aware, with respect to Greg, do you recall how Greg was hired?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I honestly don't remember.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura --
MS. JOHNSON: I'm sorry. Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-624.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-624 to be?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jonathan.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you know Jonathan?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We saw him, um, several times.
MS. JOHNSON: Who is we?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean and I.
MS. JOHNSON: In what cities did you -- city or cities did you see Jonathan?
CASANDRA VENTURA: In Miami, mostly. I don't know if he flew anywhere.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please take that down and pull up Government Exhibit 2A-632.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-632 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't remember his name.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you recognize him?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you recognize him?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He looks familiar from the freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: How, if you remember, was he hired for freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't remember, but it was in New York, I think.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please take that down and pull up Government Exhibit 2A-633.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-633 as?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Brian.
MS. JOHNSON: And how did you know Brian?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was hired as an escort, I believe, through Craigslist or something.
MS. JOHNSON: In what city?
CASANDRA VENTURA: In New York.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now. Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-628.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you recognize -- how do you know the individual depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-628?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was also hired as an escort, and his name is Vin. And it was through Garren. In Vegas and LA.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, in looking through those photos, you often said we hired him as an escort. Who's the "we" in that situation?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Who primarily reached out to the escorts?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you primarily reach out to the escorts?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, just based on who Sean is, I didn't want to put him in that position. And that was just my job, really.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say that was your job, what do you mean by that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was expected of me.
MS. JOHNSON: Who expected it of you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Who, if anyone, told you to reach out to these escorts?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean did.
MS. JOHNSON: And for all the individuals whose photos I've just shown you, in addition to the photos we saw yesterday, what event did you see all those individuals for?
CASANDRA VENTURA: For freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: Was Sean involved in all of the freak-offs with those individuals?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you have sex or perform sex acts with all of the individuals that we saw during those freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Were all those individuals paid?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I'm not sure.
MS. JOHNSON: OK. If they were paid --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: Sustained.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, were at least some of those individuals paid?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: For the individuals who were paid, whose money was used to pay them?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean's money.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can we pull up for identification Government Exhibit B-622 for the court and parties only. Can you please pull up the second page, too, Ms. Gavin.
(Counsel confer)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize the document depicted in Government Exhibit B-622?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes. It's a text between me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And how do you recognize it?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Our phone numbers and our names.
MS. JOHNSON: Is this a fair and accurate text between you and Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: The government offers Government Exhibit B-622.
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: All right. This exhibit will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibit B-622 received in evidence)
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Directing your attention, Ms. Ventura, to the page on the left, on the top page. Who are the --
MS. JOHNSON: Can you publish to the jury. Thank you, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Who are the participants in this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And turning to the communication on the second page on the bottom. Can you blow that up, please, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent this text message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's from Sean to me.
MS. JOHNSON: What's the date of this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: January 26, 2016.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you please read this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: You know we have to have a proper FO without no K. I need to get it out of my head. I hate K. So you let me know when. Please don't be mad and think that's all I wanna do. It's just the ksa bathed us. I don't know. A successful FO is when we remember and we don't be friending to do it the right way. I won't bring up again until you are in that mood. And I'll fly Dave in. Sorry.
MS. JOHNSON: What is your understanding of what K is in this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's ketamine, the drug.
MS. JOHNSON: Is ketamine a drug that was used at some freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Who gave you ketamine at some freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean had it.
MS. JOHNSON: What was your understanding of what Sean was saying about K in this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That it took time out of the freak-off. Um, it was my preferred drug, because it was very dissociative and you can go into something called a K hole, where you're not present in the moment. So I think that's what was happening here.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say took time out of the freak-off, what do you -- what do you mean by that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just high and not doing any actions.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say not doing any actions, are you referring to sex acts?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sex acts, intercourse, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: And, Ms. Gavin, can you take this down and turn to page six of this document, please.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to these messages, who sent these messages?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did.
MS. JOHNSON: And can you read the top message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That is all we do and I'm just getting back on track. I'm sure you can call Kim or something.
MS. JOHNSON: When you said this is all we do, what were you referring to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: When you said I'm just getting back on track, what were you referring to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just back in, like, recovery mode and feeling like I could get back to work, get back to what I really wanted to be doing.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say what you really wanted to be doing, did you want to be doing freak-offs?
MS. JOHNSON: During freak-offs, was there anything you tried to avoid doing physically with the escorts?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, I was really against kissing. I just felt, like, it was too intimate. But, um, it still happened anyway.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did it still happen?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean would request to see it, so then I would do it.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you tell Sean that you didn't want to kiss the escorts?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did, at a point, yeah. Definitely didn't -- it made me like squeamish. I don't know.
MS. JOHNSON: After you told Sean you didn't want to kiss the escorts, did Sean still request that you kiss the else?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, on different occasions.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, if you can please pull up again Government Exhibit B-222 in evidence, page two. I'm sorry. I gave you the wrong number. Government Exhibit B-622 in evidence, page two. If you can zoom in on this bubble.
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to that last sentence, and I'll fly Dave in.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Who is Dave?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Dave is one of the escorts that was used.
MS. JOHNSON: What was your understanding of what Sean was offering to fly Dave in for?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was offering to fly him in for a freak-off.
MS. JOHNSON: Where does Dave live, if you know?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I believe he lives in New York.
MS. JOHNSON: And in what cities did you have freak-offs with Dave and Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: New York City, Miami, Los Angeles, Vegas. I'm not sure.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to your 29th birthday, how did you spend your 29th birthday?
CASANDRA VENTURA: There was a surprise dinner thrown for me at a restaurant in LA. And, yeah, my friends were there.
MS. JOHNSON: Who threw that dinner for you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Was Sean present at the dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Were you expecting Sean to be present at the dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I wasn't. I thought he wasn't coming.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you think he wasn't coming?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because he told me that he wasn't going to be able to make it.
MS. JOHNSON: After dinner, what did you want to do to celebrate your birthday?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I wanted to go to this club called Blind Dragon and do karaoke with my friends.
MS. JOHNSON: What happened after dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: After dinner, um, we were starting to -- like, all of my friends and I were starting to head towards that way. Um, but Sean already let me know that he had wanted to have a freak-off. And I was, like, OK, not right now. Like, I really wanted to celebrate my birthday. We ended up getting to Blind Dragon, but he kept pulling me away from my friends. And I eventually just left.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, did you tell Sean about what you wanted to do on the night of your 29th birthday?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I told him that I wanted to stay out and celebrate with my friends. And, in my mind, I didn't want the burden of having to do that at the end of the night. I ... I just wanted to have my birthday.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to have a freak-off that night?
MS. JOHNSON: What ended up happening that night?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We went to Blind Dragon for a bit, but he pulled me out so many times, I just, like I said, I gave up and, again, had a freak-off.
MS. JOHNSON: Who, if anyone, was with Sean when he was pulling you out of the Blind Dragon to have conversations?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't know specifically what security, but there was security there.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, yesterday you mentioned blackmail materials. What were you referring to when you said blackmail materials?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Blackmail materials would be actual, like, sex videos, freak-off videos. Even just other embarrassing videos. Me drunk, like, anything that would make me look not great.
MS. JOHNSON: When, if ever, would Sean mention these types of videos to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Usually when he was angry about something or just really wanted me to fear --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: It's overruled.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, you can continue.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Um, can you repeat the question?
MS. JOHNSON: Of course. When, if ever, would Sean mention the freak-off videos to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He would mention them when he was upset about something. It was just a pretty common thing. One time I dated someone else and, like, that was the, like, that is what it was all about. I'm going to put out two embarrassing videos of you. He just wanted to hurt me.
MS. JOHNSON: We'll get back to that. You said this was common. How frequently did Sean bring up the freak-off videos to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, once is too much, but several times.
MS. JOHNSON: When he brought up the videos, what, if anything, do you remember him saying about the videos?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That he was going to release them and embarrass me and, yeah, put my career in jeopardy.
MS. JOHNSON: Were you afraid that the videos would be released?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Absolutely, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: What were your concerns?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That he would be mad enough to put them out, and then I would have to answer to my mother, like ...
MS. JOHNSON: Besides your mother, what, if any, other concerns did you have about the freak-off videos being released publicly?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I just feared for my career. I feared for, um, my family. Just embarrassing. All of it. It's horrible and disgusting. Like, no one should do that to anyone.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, did Sean say to you about the impact of releasing the freak-off videos?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That it could ruin everything that I worked for. Just make me look like a slut. I would be shamed, like, and I wasn't supposed to be on those videos, so ...
MS. JOHNSON: What do you mean by, I wasn't supposed to be on those videos?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't want to be in them.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit B-253.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to the top, who are the participants in this chat?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, can you please turn to page two?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Do you want me to read?
MS. JOHNSON: What's the date of this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: July 22, 2013.
MS. JOHNSON: And what -- can you please read your top message in blue?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Please delete any video out of your phone if you have. Too many people have access to your stuff.
MS. JOHNSON: And when you said video in that message, what video are you referring to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Freak-off videos.
MS. JOHNSON: And how did Sean respond?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did yesterday and no iCloud. On, all good. Ambien kicking in. Good night.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there occasions when you saw videos that you thought had been deleted?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: How frequently did that happen?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It happened often enough. More than a handful of times.
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, would it be possible to have a brief sidebar before we introduce the next series of exhibits?
THE COURT: Of course.
MS. JOHNSON: Thank you.
(Continued on next page)
(At the sidebar)
THE COURT: Ms. Johnson.
MS. JOHNSON: Thank you, Judge. I'm about to introduce the sealed exhibits. I just want to make sure we're all lined up in the procedure for how we will do this. I would ask that the TV that's shown in the gallery be turned off and we'll display them only for the well and the Court and the jury, and they're already admitted. I also wanted to make sure there's nothing being played in the overflow rooms before I do this.
MR. AGNIFILO: What exactly are you -- because our screens have protectors, but I wouldn't want anyone to see them. So even for the parties and the Court, what will actually be shown?
MS. JOHNSON: It's six still images, no sound, we won't have to do any of the headphones. But before we did this, I just wanted to make sure that nothing was accidentally being transmitted to the other overflow room. If we --
THE COURT: I would propose we take a short recess to make sure that everything's in place. And also I believe LiveNote is not functioning, so kill two birds with one stone.
(Continued on next page)
(In open court)
THE COURT: Members of the jury, we're going to take a brief 10-minute recess and we'll be back while we arrange some things in the courtroom. All rise for the jury.
(Continued on next page)
(Jury not present)
THE COURT: We're going to take a 10-minute break. Be back in 10 minutes.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Thank you.
(Witness not present)
THE COURT: Please be seated. We're going to make sure we make the adjustments as to the overflow room and also the TV back there. It may take a couple minutes. I assume there's nothing else to address at this time?
MR. AGNIFILO: We're trying to work out a possibility of maybe we can see it beforehand so that we don't have to play any part of it, even on the monitors for the parties.
THE COURT: Sounds good.
MR. DONALDSON: We're also working on the live feed.
(Recess)
THE COURT: Have we resolved all of our issues?
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, we have a solution and we're going to employ that solution after lunch because there's still some issues with the screens, but we'll be able to proceed with that section after lunch and we'll do something else now until lunch.
THE COURT: Could we have Ms. Ventura back.
MS. JOHNSON: Yes.
(Witness present)
(Continued on next page)
(Jury present)
THE COURT: Ms. Ventura, you understand you're still under oath?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
THE COURT: Ms. Johnson, you may proceed.
MS. JOHNSON: Before I get back to questioning Ms. Ventura, I'm going to offer a few additional exhibits into evidence that were on Government Exhibit B that Ms. Ventura -- the drive that Ms. Ventura reviewed. So at this point, at this time, the government offers B-413, B-414, B-415, B-416, B-418, B-420 B-421, B-422, B-425, B-427, B-431, B-432, B-504, B-506, B-507, B-510, B-512, B-513, B-514, B-610, B-611, B-613, B-614, B-615, B-616, B-617, B-623, B-624 and all subdivisions thereof at this time.
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: Those exhibits will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibits B-413, B-414, B-415, B-416, B-418, B-420 B-421, B-422, B-425, B-427, B-431, B-432, B-504, B-506, B-507, B-510, B-512, B-513, B-514, B-610, B-611, B-613, B-614, B-615, B-616, B-617, B-623, B-624 received in evidence)
BY MS. JOHNSON:
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, before we broke, we were discussing the freak-off videos. Do you remember that testimony?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, could you please pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 263.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who are the participants in this chat?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, could you put up pages 2 and 3 side-by-side.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to the blue bubbles at the top of the screen, the second full one down that says, I need you to call me ASAP. Do you see that bubble?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: What is the date of that text message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: March 9th, 2014.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent that text message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did, to Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Directing your attention to the gray bubbles underneath that message, can you read those, please.
CASANDRA VENTURA: I called. Pick up. When did he say he saw it. How long ago. Ask him what did the room look like et cetera. Girl you need to act like you need to get this info.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recall what this conversation with Sean was about?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: What was it about?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was in Atlantic City hosting a party with new, like, management company. While they're out, somebody that I was working with mentioned that they had seen sexually explicit video of me and, immediately, my thoughts went to a freak-off video, so I reached out to Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Who was the individual who had seen the sexually explicit video of you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The person who was talking about it, his name was Sugin.
MS. JOHNSON: And to be clear for the record, was this individual saying he had seen the video or just speaking of a video?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was speaking of a video.
MS. JOHNSON: Looking at the next page, page 3, at the gray bubbles in the bottom, who sends those messages?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And can you read the messages.
CASANDRA VENTURA: You gotta tell him this is your life and this is serious. Ask him how did Whoo Kid bring it up. Did he say, hey, look, I got this video with Cassie. The natural question Sugin would have asked is how did he get the footage and what is he planning on doing with it. You got to tell him this is your life and this is serious.
MS. JOHNSON: Who is Whoo Kid?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He's a DJ.
MS. JOHNSON: How, if at all, is Whoo Kid involved in this incident?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I think that he was the one that told Sugin about this video, or that's at least what I gathered from the beginning of the conversations.
MS. JOHNSON: Taking that down, can you move to page 4, please. Ms. Gavin, can you blow up the bubbles in the middle of the page starting with, are you talking to him yet.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, when Sean said are you talking to him yet, what's your understanding of who Sean was referencing?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He was referencing Sugin.
MS. JOHNSON: And the bottom gray bubble, could you read that bubble.
CASANDRA VENTURA: This is crazy. Do not let him out of your site. Wtf.
MS. JOHNSON: In that message, do you have an understanding of who Sean is referencing when he says do not let him out of your sight?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes. He's talking about Sugin.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: After this conversation with Sean, what did you do, Ms. Ventura?
CASANDRA VENTURA: After that conversation, we were headed back in a car from Atlantic City where the party was to New York the following day. We were headed there to basically have a conversation with Sugin and Whoo Kid, and I was accompanied by security.
MS. JOHNSON: Who was in the car with you from Atlantic City to New York?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was me, Sugin, and Kerry Morgan.
MS. JOHNSON: Why was Sugin in the car with you and Kerry back to New York?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We were coming from a party and he wasn't in a great condition, but we -- I was told not to let him out of my sight. So he stayed with me.
MS. JOHNSON: Who told you not to let him out of your sight?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And you also referenced having a discussion with Sugin and Whoo Kid. Did that discussion happen?
CASANDRA VENTURA: There was a discussion that happened later that night.
MS. JOHNSON: Where did it happen?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was at restaurant somewhere in New York. I don't remember exactly where.
MS. JOHNSON: What was the topic of discussion at that restaurant?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The topic of discussion was where is this video, does this video exist, who saw it, what's in it, like every detail that they could come up with.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say they in that sentence, who is they?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sugin and -- yeah, party.
MS. JOHNSON: Was it Sugin and Whoo Kid?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah. I really didn't speak to Whoo Kid too much about it.
MS. JOHNSON: And you mentioned security. What was security's role in this discussion that you had with Sugin?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I felt like security's role was just to intimidate them in getting the truth and getting real information.
MS. JOHNSON: Where was security during this discussion?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We were sitting in the middle of the restaurant floor. I think it was like a lower level and then the security was lined around the outside of the room.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you invite security to join you at this dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, I was told to bring as much security as I could.
MS. JOHNSON: Who told you to bring as much security as you could?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean. But it was set up by whoever was in New York, which I don't know.
MS. JOHNSON: Who do you recall from security being present at this dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I recall Uncle Paulie.
MS. JOHNSON: Who did Uncle Paulie work for?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And how did others react at the dinner to the presence of security?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I think everyone was just scared and really confused. I don't know if everybody knew why we were there. Yeah, I'm not really sure.
MS. JOHNSON: And besides security, who else, if anyone, who worked for Sean was present at the dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: James Cruz, who worked for Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And can you remind the jury of James Cruz's role.
CASANDRA VENTURA: James acted as my manager for some years and worked with Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Turning to a different topic now. After a freak-off, how did you and Sean typically recover?
CASANDRA VENTURA: If we were going to stay together, like, that night or after, we'd usually go back to his place, whichever city, and get IV fluids, massages, we eat, the chef would cook us some food. Just trying to take care of ourselves.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if any, drugs did you take after freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I personally -- I had an ongoing, off-and-on addiction with opiates. So I would take the opiates to come down from the ecstasy and MDMA from, like, turned up party.
MS. JOHNSON: How did the opiates make you feel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Opiates make me feel numb, which is why I rely on them so heavily. Yeah, that's the best way to describe it.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you want to feel numb?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't want to feel what was actually going on in my mind, in my real life, in real time. It was just an escape for me.
MS. JOHNSON: How often did you take opiates after freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Pretty often. Not every time. There were times when I wasn't on them, but when I was, I was.
MS. JOHNSON: And how did you get the opiates that you took after freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: From a drug dealer or friends, like, however at the time.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there any occasions when Sean gave you opiates?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes. More so in the beginning of our relationship.
MS. JOHNSON: And approximately what years -- when you say the beginning of your relationship, Sean gave you opiates sometimes, what years, approximately, would those be?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It would be like 2007, 2008, from there.
MS. JOHNSON: As a result of freak-offs, what, if any, medical issues did you experience?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I had a lot of stomach issues and like gastrointestinal issues from taking drugs. I also would get frequent UTIs, which are, if you've had one, you know how painful that is.
MS. JOHNSON: Just stopping you there, Ms. Ventura, what does UTI stand for?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Urinary tract infection.
MS. JOHNSON: Focusing on that infection, how frequently did you get UTIs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: When we were having frequent freak-offs, it was -- sometimes they were back-to-back. Sometimes I couldn't get rid of it and I was actually doing the freak-off with an infection.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say sometimes they were back-to-back, what's the they in that sentence?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The they is the UTI infection.
MS. JOHNSON: You described your UTIs as painful. How painful were they?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Very painful. It varied. I would try to flush out, just drink tons of water, cranberry juice, cranberry pills. I got to the point where Cipro didn't even work anymore, which is a -- it was an antibacterial medicine. Yeah, just was a mess, like, really painful for a long time. I actually can't believe that I actually dealt with that.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you talk to Sean about your UTIs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, he knew that I would get them.
MS. JOHNSON: You mentioned you had freak-offs with UTIs; is that correct?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sometimes, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: How did it feel to have sex while you had a UTI?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, horrible. It's the most uncomfortable burning. I would not advise it.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can we please bring up Government Exhibit 340 in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who are the participants in this conversation?
CASANDRA VENTURA: This is me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you please turn to page 2 and 3, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, we're going to read this message out loud. If you could read the blue messages and I'll read the gray messages.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Okay.
MS. JOHNSON: You can start.
CASANDRA VENTURA: I feel okay. Just a little achy and tired. How are you feeling.
MS. JOHNSON: I feel good. Miss you though. Shake it off and smile all day. I had a great time with you this weekend. Thank you.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me, too. I love you. I miss you.
MS. JOHNSON: What's your day like? What's the plan, Stan?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Studio, cutting vocals, workout after, get my shit together.
MS. JOHNSON: Let's go.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Have a great day. I love you.
MS. JOHNSON: Please email me my pics. What you doing? Hello. Before we move on to the next page, what's your understanding of what Sean was referencing when he says, please email me my pics?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I actually don't know.
MS. JOHNSON: We can go on to pages 4 and 5, please.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, starting at the top in blue.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Hello. I sent them yesterday.
MS. JOHNSON: Not all of them. What you doin?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Okay. Vocals.
MS. JOHNSON: How are vocals going?
CASANDRA VENTURA: They're good. I have all these sores on my tongue, so it's kind of uncomfortable, and I think I have another UTI. How's your day?
MS. JOHNSON: Pausing there. In these messages, you reference having sores on your tongue. What were you talking about there?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Occasionally I would get sores on my tongue from the freak-offs, the taking drugs, substances, and just friction in my mouth. So pretty sure that's what I'm talking about.
MS. JOHNSON: What was the friction in your mouth from?
CASANDRA VENTURA: From oral sex. Also from having my mouth on things where there was oil and Astroglide and lubricants.
MS. JOHNSON: How did the mouth sores you would get feel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just stinging and uncomfortable.
MS. JOHNSON: And below that you tell Sean, I think I have another UTI and have a sad face after that, right?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: How often did you tell Sean about your UTIs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was pretty open with him about it, and they were regular, so --
MS. JOHNSON: I'll continue reading on page 5 with the gray bubble from Sean. I'm good. Shit. Need you to go to doc.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, we did a lot.
MS. JOHNSON: What you mean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: A lot of dicks, a lot of partying.
MS. JOHNSON: So pausing you there, what are you referencing when you say a lot of dicks, a lot of partying?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The freak-off.
MS. JOHNSON: And relative to a photograph, when is this communication with Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The next day it was, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: So after a freak-off?
CASANDRA VENTURA: After a freak-off, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: I'll continue on reading with the Sean bubble. So you feel sick? I'm sorry.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Why you sorry?
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you ask Sean why he was sorry?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I really took the blame for things. I don't know. I guess I just didn't understand why he was saying sorry about something that had happened many times.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin. Can you please pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 341.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who are the participants in this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Turning to the next page, what's the date of this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: July 18th, 2012.
MS. JOHNSON: And relative to the last exhibit we looked at, do you recall how soon after the last exhibit this was sent?
CASANDRA VENTURA: No. I missed it.
MS. JOHNSON: We'll come back to that.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Okay.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you read the first sentence of your message here.
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't mean that the weekend was hell, but it was on my body.
MS. JOHNSON: And what are you referring to when you say I didn't mean the weekend was hell, but it was on my body?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Talking about the freak-off and staying up and partying.
MS. JOHNSON: Physically, how did you feel after freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I just felt so tired and achy and really dehydrated because you're up for so long, not really eating too much. I used to try to drink as much waters as I could, but staying up that long and taking that many drugs for that long is kind of -- it is what it is.
MS. JOHNSON: How did you feel emotionally after freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Ooh, emotionally, after freak-offs were just like empty, especially if we didn't continue our schedules, Sean and I together. If I didn't stay with him or whatever, it just felt like, okay, I did my job and now I'm going about the rest of my life. Yeah, they're really empty. I definitely felt just gross, same feelings over and over.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take this exhibit down, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, other than freak-offs, did Sean ever ask you to participate in sexual activity involving other people?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sex clubs, but it wasn't -- I wasn't really asked for participation, I wouldn't say.
MS. JOHNSON: What is a sex club, first of all?
CASANDRA VENTURA: A sex club is a club where they have special rooms where you can have sex with people.
MS. JOHNSON: When, if ever, have you visited a sex club?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I visited a few with Sean over the years. New York, I don't know what it was called. Las Vegas has a club called The Green Door. There were some in Los Angeles that we would drive to.
MS. JOHNSON: Whose idea was it to visit sex clubs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was Sean's.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to go to sex clubs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't. I was always terrified and would drink quite a bit.
MS. JOHNSON: Why were you terrified?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It wasn't an experience that I was into. It just wasn't my thing.
MS. JOHNSON: Yesterday, do you recall telling the jury about Sean discussing the swingers lifestyle with you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: What did Sean tell you that swinging was?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, based off of what I kind of knew already and what he told me, it was you could swap partners and everybody's okay with it. It's a certain type of lifestyle and that was a turn-on for him.
MS. JOHNSON: How, if at all, did your understanding of the swingers lifestyle relate to freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I related them pretty closely just because of the sexual nature and me actually having intercourse with somebody else besides him.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to do freak-offs?
MS. JOHNSON: When you went to sex clubs with Sean, who else, if anyone, went with you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sometimes an escort would go with us. One time we went with an escort and their spouse, their girlfriend.
MS. JOHNSON: Whose idea was it to have an escort come with you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was Sean's and the escort, I guess.
MS. JOHNSON: Which escort came to sex clubs with you and Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jules.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that the same Jules from the Intercontinental Hotel incident?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: You mentioned you would drink before going to sex clubs; is that right?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: What else, if anything, would you ingest before going to sex clubs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, alcohol, if that's what was there, MDMA, ecstasy, GHP was a big one.
MS. JOHNSON: Who provided you with the MDMA, ecstasy, or GHP?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: At sex clubs, who, if anyone, did you have sex with?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I had sex with Sean and Jules at a point.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to have sex with Jules?
CASANDRA VENTURA: No, not at the sex club, no. No.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to have sex with Jules ever?
CASANDRA VENTURA: No. No. Jules was like, within all of it, was like a safe place. I saw him a lot. We actually had our own friendship. So being able to have sex with Jules instead of somebody at the club was much better than having to have sex with somebody else that I didn't know at the club, if that makes sense.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you have sex with Jules at the club?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I was -- just, that's what was happening. Sean would request it or we would just do it. It's what we did.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you want to be having sex with Jules at the sex club?
MS. JOHNSON: And what was your reaction to visiting these sex clubs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was just confusing. By that point, I was pretty messed up. I remember there being a time where I got just way too drunk to do anything and we had to leave. It's just uncomfortable when it's not something you're into. I'm not into seeing the person I'm in love with be with somebody else. That's not my thing.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, did you tell Sean about whether you wanted to go to sex clubs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was vocal about it. I told him it made me uncomfortable. He knew. He knew how I behaved --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: That's sustained. Ms. Johnson, you can move on to another question.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, how long were you with Sean in total, how many years?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Almost 11 years.
MS. JOHNSON: And during those 11 years, did you become familiar with Sean's moods and actions?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Did he become familiar with yours?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: And when you would tell Sean that you didn't want to go to sex clubs, how would he respond?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I feel like -- I feel like some of the time he would just try to turn the energy around and just keep it positive --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: That's overruled.
MS. JOHNSON: What do you mean by turn the energy around? Can you give me an example.
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean just be playful and fun instead of scary. Like, it wasn't always, like, a scary thing with him. Can you repeat it.
MS. JOHNSON: Sure. When you would tell Sean that you didn't want to go to sex clubs, how would he respond?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, it varied on the situation. But he'd really just like push, keep pushing or just try to convince that would be a fun thing to do, or we wouldn't go for long, or --
MS. JOHNSON: Did you end up going?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you drink so much when you went to sex clubs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I didn't know how to be there sober.
MS. JOHNSON: So moving on to a different topic. We talked about the Intercontinental yesterday and this morning. Aside from that incident, when, if ever, did you leave a freak-off before it was finished?
CASANDRA VENTURA: There were other times where I tried to leave, but I would always end up back at the room.
MS. JOHNSON: Why would you try to leave?
CASANDRA VENTURA: If we were having just a bad time, if I was scared of him, if I felt like uncomfortable, unsafe, would just leave and go -- sometimes end up in the kitchen at the hotel, like, hiding. It depended on what it was.
MS. JOHNSON: When you left the hotel room, where did you go?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Typically out the back of the hotel, like, I would try to find my way out the back and into, like, alley spaces. I remember doing that at the L'Ermitage a lot.
MS. JOHNSON: Is the L'Ermitage in Los Angeles?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Uh-huh.
MS. JOHNSON: You said you would always end up back in the room; is that right?
CASANDRA VENTURA: For the most part, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there occasions where you didn't end up back in the room?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Not that I recall, except for the Intercontinental time.
MS. JOHNSON: How did you end up back in the room?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean would find me. He would come looking for me and find me, call me. Yeah, I would be found.
MS. JOHNSON: And after Sean found you, where would you go?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Back to the room.
MS. JOHNSON: Would the freak-off continue back at the room?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Usually, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there times that you were injured at a freak-off?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: How were you injured?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Put his hands on me or -- yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Who put his hands on you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say put his hands on you, can you describe what actions he took?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He would grab me up, push me down, hit me in the side of the head, kick me, like, you name it.
MS. JOHNSON: Who else, if anyone, was present when Sean put his hands on you at freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sometimes it was just us and then other times there was an escort close by.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there occasions when the escort was in the same room with you and Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, we were in the same hotel room.
MS. JOHNSON: Same hotel room or same room within the suite?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Hotel room. I don't remember specifically somebody watching me get beat up.
MS. JOHNSON: So just so clarify, do you recall if an escort was present in the same room while Sean was putting his hands on you at a freak-off?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: Who do you recall being present for that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jules.
MS. JOHNSON: And were there other times where the escort was present in the hotel room, but not in the room inside the suite where Sean was putting his hands on you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: If you know, were escorts aware of what was happening between you and Sean on those occasions?
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: It's overruled.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you want me to ask it again, Ms. Ventura? On the occasions when you were inside of a hotel room and you and Sean were in one room and an escort was in a different room in a suite, if you know, were escorts aware of what was happening in the room where you and Sean were?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes, because they could hear it and would ask me afterwards if I was okay. So yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Would you know that the escorts heard it because they asked you if you were okay?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes.
MS. JOHNSON: How soon after freak-offs started was Sean physical with you during freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, within that first year, we were definitely partying quite a bit.
MS. JOHNSON: And in what cities do you recall Sean putting his hands on you during freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: You said city?
MS. JOHNSON: Which cities.
CASANDRA VENTURA: New York and Los Angeles for sure, Miami.
MS. JOHNSON: How frequently did Sean put his hands on you at freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Too frequently, a lot.
MS. JOHNSON: I'm going to move to a different topic now. Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit B-255.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who are the participants in the communication at Government Exhibit B-255?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please turn to page 2.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to the top message, what's the date of that message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's August 5th, 2013.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you read the first message.
CASANDRA VENTURA: We went across to the Abbey. The gays live on a Sunday lol.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent that message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me to Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say the Abbey, what's the Abbey?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's a club in Los Angeles. On Sunday, it's a gay club.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say we, who is with you at the Abbey on August 5, 2013?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was there with Diontae and a group of friends.
MS. JOHNSON: We can take that down and, Ms. Gavin, can you pull up for identification, for the Court and the parties, Government Exhibit 2A-504.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize who is depicted in Government Exhibit 2A-504?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes. That's Diontae Nash.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you recognize Diontae Nash?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He's my friend of many years.
MS. JOHNSON: Is this a fair and accurate photo of Diontae Nash?
MS. JOHNSON: The government offers Government Exhibit 2A-504.
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: It will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibit 2A-504 received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please publish this exhibit to the jury.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, is this the Diontae who was at the Abbey with you on August 5th, 2013?
MS. JOHNSON: After the Abbey, where did you go?
CASANDRA VENTURA: After the Abbey, I went back home to my apartment on Doheny and I was supposed to be packing for a festival, a music festival.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, you can take down this photo.
MS. JOHNSON: What music festival were you packing for?
CASANDRA VENTURA: OVO Fest.
MS. JOHNSON: What's OVO Fest?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It is a music festival in Canada that the artist, Drake, throws.
MS. JOHNSON: Who else, if anyone, was at your apartment while you were packing?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Another friend, Mia, was with me and Diontae.
MS. JOHNSON: And what happened at your apartment while you were packing?
CASANDRA VENTURA: When Sean came in, I was actually asleep, and it just was commotion, him yelling at us about me being passed out on the couch, about me being asleep and not packing. Diontae and Mia had jumped on his back, on Sean's back because he was trying to attack me. Eventually, we ended up in from the living room into the master bedroom and I think they were still jumping on his back. When he threw me down, I cut my eyebrow on the corner of my bed.
MS. JOHNSON: A couple followup questions, Ms. Ventura. When you say they were jumping on his back, who was jumping on whose back?
CASANDRA VENTURA: My friends Mia and Diontae were jumping on Sean's back.
MS. JOHNSON: And you said you got thrown down onto the bed frame; is that right?
MS. JOHNSON: Who threw you onto the bed frame?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean threw me onto the bed frame.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if any, injuries did you have?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I had a pretty significant gash on the side of my eyebrow.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please publish what's in evidence as Government Exhibit B-247-A.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize what's depicted in this exhibit?
MS. JOHNSON: What is it?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's my eyebrow after I was thrown.
MS. JOHNSON: After you were thrown into the bed frame as you just described?
MS. JOHNSON: Who threw you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if any, medical treatment did you receive for the injury depicted in Government Exhibit B-247-A?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't go to the ER or anything. I ended up -- it was a Sunday, and so nothing was open. Sean had security bring me to a plastic surgeon's office that opened up in Beverly Hills that Sunday to suture it.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say security, who from security brought you to the doctor's office?
CASANDRA VENTURA: D Rock.
MS. JOHNSON: Who's choice was it for security to accompany you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin, and can you please pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit B-247. You can publish that. If you can go to -- before you go to page 2, I'm sorry.
MS. JOHNSON: On page 1, who are the participants in this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And can you please go to page 2, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: What date did you send this photograph, Ms. Ventura?
CASANDRA VENTURA: August 5th, 2013.
MS. JOHNSON: And who did you send it to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: To Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And what does the text accompanying the photograph say?
CASANDRA VENTURA: So you can remember.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you write to Sean, so you can remember, with the image of your injury?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I didn't want him to forget what he did.
MS. JOHNSON: Why didn't you want him to forget what he did?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because it's awful. The very least, I just wanted him to be sorry about it.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what is the timestamp of the message when you sent this photograph?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It says 11:48 a.m.
MS. JOHNSON: And that's on August 5th, 2013?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can we please return to Government Exhibit B-255, which is in evidence, and can you publish page 7 of that exhibit, please. If you can zoom in on the bottom of the screen, please, starting with the third message from the bottom.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to that top message, what's the date and time of this message?
CASANDRA VENTURA: August 5th, 2013, 11:51 a.m.
MS. JOHNSON: And is that approximately three minutes after the photograph you just sent to Sean?
MS. JOHNSON: Can you read the message in gray, please.
CASANDRA VENTURA: You. Don't know. When to. Stop. You have pushed it too far. And continue to push. Sad.
MS. JOHNSON: Who sent that message to you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: And can you remind the jury what you were doing when Sean came into your apartment?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was sleeping.
MS. JOHNSON: And how do you respond to Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just say sorry. Have some sympathy. I came in saying sorry and I didn't even know why I deserved that. You could care less if I was okay.
MS. JOHNSON: So you mentioned that you were at home packing when Sean came over. Did you go to the music festival you were packing for after this incident?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please take that down and pull up what's in evidence as Government Exhibit B-207.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who is depicted in Government Exhibit B-207?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That's me and French Montana, who is another artist.
MS. JOHNSON: Where are you in the photograph at B-207?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We are in a greenroom in Canada, in Toronto, at the OVO Fest.
MS. JOHNSON: And was the cut on your eyebrow visible in this photograph?
MS. JOHNSON: Why is it not visible?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I styled my hair over it.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that your hair on the right-hand side of your face when you're looking at the photograph?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: After OVO Fest, where did you go?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We went to the Hamptons from there.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: When you were in the Hamptons, what, if anything, happened in the Hamptons?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean wanted to have a freak-off. So after we hung out with our friends for a little bit, we ended up booking a motel and drove there.
MS. JOHNSON: Which escort attended the freak-off in the Hamptons motel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was Dave.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit 2A-612 in evidence.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, is this the Dave you were just referencing?
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Ventura.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, happened at that motel in the Hamptons after you arrived?
CASANDRA VENTURA: At that time we were taking GHB, and I spoke before about going into a k-hole, and on G, you can go into a g-hole, and I blacked out and that's what happened to me. And I woke up nude in the shower, and Dave and Sean were just freaking out, like, outside of the bathroom.
MS. JOHNSON: What was your understanding of why Dave and Sean were freaking out when you woke up nude in the shower?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I blacked out and I'm not sure, I didn't see myself, but it wasn't pretty.
MS. JOHNSON: And after you woke up in the shower, what happened next?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I spoke to one of Sean's friends over the phone and then we had a freak-off.
MS. JOHNSON: With Dave?
CASANDRA VENTURA: With Dave.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up the communication at Government Exhibit B-247 in evidence. Can you go to page 3, please.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what is the date of the -- before I get to the date, what does the photograph depict in this exhibit?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's my eyebrow healed up a little bit.
MS. JOHNSON: And what's the date on this image?
CASANDRA VENTURA: August 13th, 2013.
MS. JOHNSON: So is August 13th, 2013 a little over a week later from August 5th, the date you were injured?
MS. JOHNSON: And how soon after OVO Fest did you go to the Hamptons?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Right after.
MS. JOHNSON: And how soon after your injury on August 5th did you go to OVO Fest?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Right after.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if any, scars do you have from this injury?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I have a permanent scar on my eyebrow now. I cover it with makeup.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down now, Ms. Gavin. Ms. Gavin, can you pull up for identification only for the Court and the parties Government Exhibit 9D-102.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, do you recognize who's depicted in Government Exhibit 9D-102?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yup, that's me and at the Con Film Festival. I'm not sure what year.
MS. JOHNSON: How do you recognize yourself at the Con Film Festival?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I do. That's me there.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that a fair and accurate photograph of you at Con?
MS. JOHNSON: The government offers Government Exhibit 9D-102.
MS. ESTEVAO: No objection.
THE COURT: It will be admitted.
(Government's Exhibit 9D-102 received in evidence)
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, when you were at Con the year that this photograph was taken, where were you staying?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I was staying on a boat with Sean. It was one of his friend's yachts.
MS. JOHNSON: Was Sean also at Con with you?
MS. JOHNSON: Prior to the red carpet photograph depicted in Government Exhibit 9D-102, what, if anything, happened at Con with Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We got into an argument. He actually was accusing me of taking drugs from him and kicked me off the boat with no shoes early one morning. I walked over to his staff's hotel and I stayed in somebody's room over there.
MS. JOHNSON: When he kicked you off the boat with no shoes, what else, if anything, of yours was still on the boat?
CASANDRA VENTURA: All the stuff I flew there with, my passport, everything.
MS. JOHNSON: And relative to the red carpet depicted in 9D-102, when were you kicked off the boat?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Earlier that morning.
MS. JOHNSON: And the red carpet that's depicted in Government Exhibit 9D-102, what was the occasion for that red carpet event?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was just a movie premiere.
MS. JOHNSON: Did you attend the movie after the red carpet?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did.
MS. JOHNSON: You can take that down, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: Who else was at the movie, if anyone?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean and security.
MS. JOHNSON: Who do you recall from security being present?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I don't remember.
MS. JOHNSON: But when you say security, was it Sean's security?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was Sean's security, yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, happened during the movie at Con?
CASANDRA VENTURA: During the movie, we hadn't spoken. Sean and I hadn't spoken at all since the incident where he kicked me off the boat. So it was just getting evil glares. While we were sitting together during the movie, he would grab my leg and like squeeze my thigh as tightly as he could, and I was wearing a beaded dress, so it was really painful, but nobody knew, just squeezing my leg.
MS. JOHNSON: After the movie, how soon did you return to the U.S.?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Within the next 24 hours I would say.
MS. JOHNSON: How did you get back to the United States?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We flew on a commercial flight on the same flight.
MS. JOHNSON: What city did you fly into?
CASANDRA VENTURA: To New York.
MS. JOHNSON: Where did you sit on that commercial flight?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I had a seat that I traded with someone else because I didn't want to sit next to Sean at that point, and then he switched seats with the person next to me at that point. So we still ended up riding together.
MS. JOHNSON: What, if anything, did Sean show you on the flight back to New York from France?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He pulled up videos that I thought I had deleted, some freak-off videos out of his computer, like I thought I really deleted them out. He had them pulled up and was playing them for me on the flight back to New York.
MS. JOHNSON: On what device was he playing them for you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: On his laptop, one of his devices.
MS. JOHNSON: Were there other people around you when he was playing the freak-off videos?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah.
MS. JOHNSON: What did he say about the videos while he was playing them for you on the plane?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That he was going to embarrass me and release them. Just threats to release the videos.
MS. JOHNSON: When Sean was playing freak-off videos for you on the plane, how did you feel?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Couldn't have felt worse. Also scared. I just had my -- sort of got my passport back. I just felt trapped, like, how do you get out of this situation when somebody's -- I don't know. Felt trapped.
MS. JOHNSON: When you landed in New York, what did you do?
CASANDRA VENTURA: We landed in New York, ended up going to a dinner, and he wanted to have a freak-off, so we had a freak-off.
MS. JOHNSON: How soon after dinner did you have a freak-off?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Right after.
MS. JOHNSON: How soon after landing in New York was dinner?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Within a couple of hours, an hour or two.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you do the freak-off?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Honestly, at that point, whatever was going to make him not be angry at me and threatening me I was willing to do. Yeah, I just didn't want to feel scared anymore and one thing he made me feel like I was good at.
MS. JOHNSON: What concerns did you have if Sean was threatening you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: That he could put these videos out and ruin everything for me, embarrass me. Just make me out to be somebody that I'm not in a very unfair way.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you think it was unfair?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Which part?
MS. JOHNSON: You just said it was a very unfair way. Can you explain what you mean by that.
CASANDRA VENTURA: I mean, the leverage of having an incriminating or a derogatory, humiliating video of somebody, telling them they're going to release it if you don't behave the way they want you to or whatever the case may be. It was just always like that. Like, that's -- that was a big part of our relationship.
MS. JOHNSON: And who told you that the videos would be released?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up what is in evidence as Government Exhibit B-248.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, who are the participants in this chat?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Me and Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Gavin, can you pull up pages 2 and 3 side-by-side.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, directing your attention to the top bubble on page 2, what's the date of that communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: June 15th, 2013.
MS. JOHNSON: So I'll read the gray bubbles and you read the blue bubbles. I'm here.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Comin.
MS. JOHNSON: Yo, I'm outside.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Your sex makes me high. No, like literally. I feel like I just took a PK lol.
MS. JOHNSON: Pausing you there, when you say I feel like I just took a PK, what does PK refer to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: A painkiller.
MS. JOHNSON: Is a painkiller the same as the opiates you were describing earlier?
MS. JOHNSON: When you say your sex makes me high, whose sex are you referring to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean's.
MS. JOHNSON: During your relationship, who did you want to have sex with?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Wanted to have sex with Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Continuing on. Dope. I was thinking about a freak-off, but I need to be focused. Hello.
CASANDRA VENTURA: You do or I do? Hello.
MS. JOHNSON: We both do. I was just telling you my thoughts.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Lol. I've been thinking about one, too. We were pretty focused last time. Just has to be the right people or person.
MS. JOHNSON: So pausing there, when you say lol, I've been thinking about one, too, what are you talking about?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I'm talking about the freak-off.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you respond to Sean that way?
CASANDRA VENTURA: This was just kind of like a normal way to respond if he was throwing the idea out there, that that's something he wanted to do. Didn't want him to think I didn't want to, so that's what I said.
MS. JOHNSON: Why didn't you want Sean thinking you didn't want to do freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because then it would be a problem, just end up fighting.
MS. JOHNSON: And what, if anything, would happen when there was a fight?
CASANDRA VENTURA: When there was a fight --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: Grounds.
MS. ESTEVAO: Speculation.
THE COURT: It's overruled.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, you were saying that you responded like this because you were worried about a fight. What, if anything, sometimes happened during fights?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Fights were just never good for any couple. If it was something he really wanted to do, like, it was going to happen. When someone's violent with you at any point, like, you know that that's --
MS. ESTEVAO: Objection.
THE COURT: That's sustained. Ms. Johnson.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, prior to this communication on June 15th, 2013, had Sean been violent with you before?
MS. JOHNSON: How many times, approximately?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Who knows.
MS. JOHNSON: And what concerns, if any, did you have about Sean being violent with you?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It was always a concern if we weren't agreeing on something or if I didn't want to get high or if I didn't want to do exactly what was being presented as something to do. It's the same thing every week.
MS. JOHNSON: And prior to this message on June 15th, 2013, had you told Sean in the past that you did not want to do freak-offs?
MS. JOHNSON: Once or more than once?
CASANDRA VENTURA: More than once.
MS. JOHNSON: So let's continue reading. I'll finish with the gray bubble on the bottom of page 3. The only way I could do is is if it was all right. I got some more G. Pausing you there before we turn the page, what is G referring to there?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The drug, GHP.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that a drug that was used at freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sometimes.
MS. JOHNSON: Who provided GHP?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you turn the page, please, Ms. Gavin, to 4 and 5.
MS. JOHNSON: Can you pick up reading there.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Exactly. Good G.
MS. JOHNSON: That's what they told me. Haha.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Question mark.
MS. JOHNSON: Call HS. Where is my pizza? Pausing there, what does HS refer to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: House. It's an abbreviation.
MS. JOHNSON: You can pick up at the blue bubble.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Picking it up now. What were you talking about before? Who told you what?
MS. JOHNSON: Call HS.
CASANDRA VENTURA: What was the MSG from before about? Ash isn't answering. Vin isn't here.
MS. JOHNSON: Pausing you there, who are Ash and Vin?
CASANDRA VENTURA: They're both escorts that were working with Garren.
MS. JOHNSON: Did we see pictures of Ash this morning?
MS. JOHNSON: Picking up. Did you call Garren?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes, he told me.
MS. JOHNSON: Does he h*ve anyone?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Probably just the guys that we said no to before. Jules hit you back.
MS. JOHNSON: Pausing you there, is this the same Jules we previously discussed?
MS. JOHNSON: And Jules is an escort?
MS. JOHNSON: Turning the page.
MS. JOHNSON: From Sean, Jules can do 12:00. We need someone from 9:00 p.m.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Okay.
MS. JOHNSON: Yeah, he said 12:00. See what he has for 9:00.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Checking.
MS. JOHNSON: Do you need to go shopping?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes, I'm going to go as soon as we're good.
MS. JOHNSON: Go. Time is ticking. I'm getting RM now. Go. Time is ticking. I'm getting RM now.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Only one available. He said good reviews. Jake -- Do you want me to keep going?
MS. JOHNSON: I'm sorry, Ms. Ventura. In the message you just read, is there a photograph accompanying that message?
MS. JOHNSON: And how would you have received that photograph that you transmitted?
CASANDRA VENTURA: From Garren.
MS. JOHNSON: You can continue.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Jake the white guy is also, but Jake can't do until 11:00.
MS. JOHNSON: And who is Jake?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's another escort.
MS. JOHNSON: Were you shown a photograph of Jake earlier this morning?
MS. JOHNSON: You can turn the page, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: You can continue at the top.
CASANDRA VENTURA: The other guy can do earlier.
MS. JOHNSON: What you think?
CASANDRA VENTURA: He said maybe he can get Jake for 10:00. Up to you. It's just one more person knowing our secret. Jake can def do 10:00.
MS. JOHNSON: When you said it's just one more person knowing our secret, what did you mean by that?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I'm referring to the freak-off and just the shame of the secret.
MS. JOHNSON: Why were you concerned if people knew about the freak-offs?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's not what I wanted people to know about.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that because you didn't want to do them?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yeah, it's because I didn't want to do them and I just didn't want to be part of that.
MS. JOHNSON: Picking up in gray. Call HS. Jules said he could do 9:00. Want to just have him after Jake?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Up to you. If you want to start sooner, we should do that.
MS. JOHNSON: Call HS. Let's do Jake 10:00. MK sure he's on time. Ima do Jules at 1:00 a.m. SLS. Before you start picking up reading, what does SLS refer to, if you know?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's a hotel in Hollywood.
MS. JOHNSON: Is that a hotel where you and Sean had freak-offs?
MS. JOHNSON: You can continue reading, Ms. Ventura.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Okay. I'm about to be home. Want me to come get you?
MS. JOHNSON: You can turn the page, Ms. Gavin.
MS. JOHNSON: I'm horny. OM playing trouble wit girls. I'm about to leave.
CASANDRA VENTURA: To go where? Hello?
MS. JOHNSON: CM down. I'm pulling up to you now. You okay?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Yes. On way hm. You at the airport? You get vallies? I'm so tense.
MS. JOHNSON: When you say valleys, what are you referring to there?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I'm referring to Valium.
MS. JOHNSON: What is Valium?
CASANDRA VENTURA: It's -- I think it's a benzo. It's like a Xanax.
MS. JOHNSON: When, if ever, would you take a Valium in relation to a freak-off?
CASANDRA VENTURA: If I had anxiety. If I just felt like my heart was racing too much, I'm not a fan.
MS. JOHNSON: Picking up with the gray bubble. Yeah, driver bringing -- I c*lled you. Pausing there, when Sean says driver bringing, what do you understand him to be referring to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: The Valium.
MS. JOHNSON: And whose driver would bring you the Valium?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Sean's driver.
MS. JOHNSON: Who was Sean's driver, if you know?
CASANDRA VENTURA: At this time, Faheem, I think, but I'm not -- the year I don't really know.
MS. JOHNSON: Was Faheem one of Sean's drivers during the time that you were in a relationship with Sean?
MS. JOHNSON: That last blue bubble, can you read that blue bubble.
CASANDRA VENTURA: You are truly the most extraordinary man. I love you so much. You make me a better woman, daughter, sister, person. I hope you always know how much I love and appreciate you. Thank you for always showing me love and happiness the way it's supposed to be. Can't wait until we have a baby of our own to celebrate Father's Day. I love you with all my heart. Happy Father's Day again. Smiley face.
MS. JOHNSON: Why did you send that message to Sean?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Because I loved him and it was Father's Day.
MS. JOHNSON: What relation, if any, did the messages before about freak-offs have to this message about Father's Day?
CASANDRA VENTURA: They're completely separate.
MS. JOHNSON: We can take that down. Ms. Gavin, can you please pull up Government Exhibit 512 that's in evidence. If you can turn to page 2, please. Could you blow up this bubble. Thank you.
MS. JOHNSON: Ms. Ventura, what's the date of this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: January 7th, 2017.
MS. JOHNSON: If you can tell from this page, who sent this communication?
CASANDRA VENTURA: I did.
MS. JOHNSON: Who did you send it to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: To Sean.
MS. JOHNSON: What does it say?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Nothing good comes out of FOs anymore. You treat me like you're Ike Turner.
MS. JOHNSON: What does FOs refer to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Freak-offs.
MS. JOHNSON: When you told Sean that he treated you like Ike Turner, what were you referring to?
CASANDRA VENTURA: Abusive, controlling.
MS. JOHNSON: What specifically did he do to be abusive and controlling?
CASANDRA VENTURA: On this date or just in general?
MS. JOHNSON: In general.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Just he was actually physically abusive. That's been said. He put me down a lot as much as I was built up, I was put down quite a bit. And that's also just like the sheer embarrassment, like how he treated me in front of other people.
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, it's 12:30. I just wanted to check in on when the Court wanted to do a lunch break.
THE COURT: If you come to a good landing place, we can do the break.
MS. JOHNSON: This is a good landing place because I'm changing topics next.
THE COURT: Thank you. Members of the jury, as a reminder, do not talk to each other about this case, and do not look up or talk to anybody about the case. We'll be back at 1:15. All rise for the Jury.
(Continued on next page)
(Jury not present)
THE COURT: Ms. Ventura, we'll be back at 1:15.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Thank you.
(Witness not present)
THE COURT: Please be seated. Ms. Slavik, have we resolved the issue with the Rule 106 issues or do we need to pick that up now or do you prefer we pick it up at the end of the lunch break?
MS. SLAVIK: Your Honor, I believe we've resolved many of them. There continue to be three exhibits where there is disagreement. I'm happy to provide those exhibit numbers for your Honor. It's B-409, B-511, and B-619.
THE COURT: Are the disagreements still the same, meaning that I have here highlighted the differences in terms of what I received yesterday, are they the same?
MS. SLAVIK: That's exactly right. I'm happy to run through at a high level what those differences are with respect to each exhibit.
THE COURT: Let's start with the 409.
MS. SLAVIK: B-409, the defense proposes adding over 10 additional pages regarding a conversation between the defendant and Ms. Ventura about masturbation. The government submits that this additional conversation is neither explanatory nor relevant to the section that the government proposes admitting.
THE COURT: Response.
MS. GERAGOS: I think the reason that we added the additional pages is it started off on -- the government's exhibit started off on, man, I just looked at my iPad, I had to stop. We wanted to put the full context of the conversation because Ms. Ventura begins this conversation by saying, I'm horny. So if you were to look at the government's exhibit, you would think that Mr. Combs started this conversation by saying, I just looked at my iPad, I had to stop, out of nowhere. In reality, if you go to our proposed exhibit from just earlier that day, it starts with Ms. Ventura saying to him, I'm horny. It is about masturbation, I suppose, but that's why he then looks at the iPad. And so it provides context to the conversation. Given that we just heard this morning about iPads and videos on his devices, the jury should know that, given the context of the conversation, she brought this up.
THE COURT: As I understand what you're saying, the issue is that the government's proposed excerpts here start out midstream in the conversation. And so to understand the context of why this is coming up in the first place, you would need to have some of the background; is that right?
MS. GERAGOS: That's right, yes.
THE COURT: So Ms. Slavik, the difficulty here is that I take it the government doesn't really want so much the first message, it's the following messages that the government --
MS. SLAVIK: That's exactly right, your Honor. The government's position is that first message regarding the iPad, that is what provides the context to the subsequent messages. The government's position is that the additional 10 pages of this back and forth regarding masturbation is not required under Rule 106 because those additional statements don't correct a distorted meaning to the text messages that the government intends to admit.
THE COURT: I agree with you that the 10 pages need not come in. However, there's probably a compromise that can be reached. I think what the defense is saying is that if you just started with that message, it might suggest that this came out of the blue and that the discussion of a sexual nature was one-sided, and then there's this followup discussion about deleting material. There's an easy workaround I can already see by looking at the messages. There's some excerpt that can be used to provide proper context so no one is misled into thinking this was a one-directional conversation from Mr. Combs' side.
MS. SLAVIK: Your Honor, that's reasonable. We'll confer with the defense and propose somewhere short of the 10 pages, something to address that issue. Moving on to 511, again, the defense proposes about 10 additional pages of fighting about infidelity, including naming names of specific individuals. I think critically in this chain, the proposed additional pages come two hours after the portion that the government proposes to admit. So that's an important distinction here. Additionally, this fight that comes in the 10 additional pages is not necessary to understand the two messages that the government is seeking to admit.
THE COURT: Here, there are two messages from Ms. Ventura, then there's a two-hour gap, followed by another message from Ms. Ventura, and then an ensuing conversation. I take it the government is saying the ensuing conversation is related to that last communication from Ms. Ventura and has nothing to do with what Ms. Ventura said in the first two messages.
MS. SLAVIK: That's right, your Honor.
THE COURT: So it's not a proper completing statement under Rule 106.
MS. SLAVIK: Correct.
THE COURT: Ms. Geragos.
MS. GERAGOS: Your Honor, I think when you read the full context of the conversation, you see the fight, even though it starts again two hours later, we are talking about the full context of the fight. This happens all the time with these two individuals. They will break for an hour, two hours, come back, and resume the fight. And so the jury, to understand these two messages, would have to understand the full context of the fight, which is about infidelity.
THE COURT: That may be true, but the statements that the government is seeking to introduce are not about the fight in general, they're about a very specific thing that Ms. Ventura has said. I'm looking through the entire communication and I don't see that coming up again after the break before Ms. Ventura's text at 11:00 a.m. Can you direct me to any message that picks up on that discussion, meaning in the first two messages, because if there is one, then I'll take a look at that.
MS. GERAGOS: No, it doesn't pick up on the specific message. I think they're just trying to contextualize it.
THE COURT: So the application to include those remaining materials under Rule 106 is denied as to B-511.
MS. SLAVIK: Finally, your Honor, B-619 is kind of similar. The government seeks to admit one specific message that's in the middle of the chain that the defendant proposes. The message that the government seeks to admit is kind of isolated both in substance and time from the other surrounding messages. So the government submits that the requirements for Rule 106 to apply are not applicable here.
MS. GERAGOS: Your Honor, I don't understand how it would be -- it's fully part of this same fight. Their second message -- first of all, going to page 706 of the document, it's not Bates stamped, but 706 of our proposed exhibit, she writes that -- he writes, I'm sorry for real, I'm really sorry. I really didn't know you felt that way about me. I feel you. Sorry. How could that not come in to understand the full context of the message? I love you forever. That's just 10 minutes after -- 9 minutes after her initial message. And then she responds to it and says you have selective memory. This entire chat should come in because it's all related to the fight that they're in the middle of.
MS. SLAVIK: Your Honor, respectfully, the burden under Rule 106 is on the defendant to demonstrate that the portions of the statements that he wants to admit are necessary to clarify or explain the portion that the government wants to admit. That's not applicable here.
THE COURT: What's the basis for admissibility of the text that the government is putting in?
MS. SLAVIK: It's a prior consistent statement, your Honor.
THE COURT: Can you explain that a little bit more.
MS. SLAVIK: Yes, your Honor. Very similar to the messages that we spoke about yesterday relating to two screenshots of an email in which Ms. Ventura --
THE COURT: Specific to the leaking of materials?
MS. SLAVIK: Correct. That's right, your Honor.
THE COURT: Ms. Geragos, I think what the government is saying is that the statement actually only relates to the leaking of material and the potential response. The followup messages that say I'm sorry, for instance, are part of the conversation. But in what way do they go towards giving proper context to what Ms. Ventura said in that one text communication? That's the real question.
MS. GERAGOS: The government is making the argument repeatedly, they've done it today all morning, that she felt like he was going to leak the videos. And so then to not have the rest of the text communication come in, that he says I'm really sorry, I really didn't know you felt that way, how could we then not put this in to complete the context of the message?
THE COURT: Well, he doesn't say, I didn't say that or I of course am not going to do that, things of that nature. That would be proper under Rule 106. But simply saying I'm sorry for having said that, that's what I'm not understanding, how that provides proper context.
MS. GERAGOS: It relates to a -- this is in 2015 and it relates to a 2011 text message. And so he's explaining he's really sorry. For real, I'm sorry, sorry for having said that. We would have to be able to put this in to complete it, otherwise it leaves the jury with a misimpression that she, again, four years later, still feels threatened and he's not addressing this point at all. I'm not sure if this could even be hearsay, his statement. He's saying he's sorry. I think it's absolutely necessary. I guess I'll withdraw from page 705 to prior, but I really think it's necessary for the jury to understand, given the testimony that we've heard this morning, the rest of the conversation.
THE COURT: You're withdrawing --
MS. GERAGOS: I'll withdraw --
THE COURT: Which part?
MS. GERAGOS: 705 before. I hear your Honor, I'm trying to be reasonable, but I'm trying to come up with a reasonable compromise that doesn't leave the jury with a misimpression as to their conversation about a conversation four years earlier.
THE COURT: That's fair. I hear your point, that it may not be directly related to the statement, but the rule says it's the remainder of or related statements, and it includes the introduction of any other statement that, in fairness, ought to be considered at the same time. And so your point is unlike the prior exhibit we just discussed, here there's a charge made by Ms. Ventura, and then there's the response to that charge that follows in the ensuing pages. There's no timing issue, none of the other issues that were presented as to the other documents. So even if that particular charge was not specifically addressed to provide fair context to that one communication, there should at least be some of the followup; is that fair?
MS. GERAGOS: That's right. Again, I'm trying to be reasonable so we could then cut it at 708.
THE COURT: I think that that's fair.
MS. SLAVIK: Your Honor, can I just note that the rule does not require admission of self-serving exculpatory statements. What it requires is correction of something that's misleading. You don't see here -- he's saying I'm sorry. He's not saying I didn't say that in 2011, I didn't do that. These statements are not necessary to correct any sort of misimpression that's left by the text that the government seeks to admit.
THE COURT: What about, I really didn't know y'all felt that way about me?
MS. SLAVIK: I believe that's in reference to, my mom remembers that. I believe that's in reference to Ms. Ventura's reference to her family feeling upset that he would make those threats. Him knowing whether her family feels that way has nothing to do with whether he actually made that threat or not.
THE COURT: I'm going to think about this over the lunch break, but for now, Ms. Geragos, just so I understand, really, it's just from 706 to I take it the first message on 708, or are you saying the message on --
MS. GERAGOS: It's 706 to the first message on 708.
THE COURT: Those are the only three?
MS. GERAGOS: That's it. But we are --
MS. SLAVIK: Your Honor -- I'm sorry to interrupt. If your Honor is inclined to grant that request to the first message on 708, the government would request that your Honor continue through 708, the additional two messages on that page. The government's first request is just the text message that the government identified, but if your Honor is inclined to add additional context, the government would request at least through the end of 708.
MS. GERAGOS: We are absolutely okay with that, your Honor.
THE COURT: I'll take a look at that one. Now, as to the witness instruction, Ms. Shapiro, you may not have had a chance to provide --
MS. SHAPIRO: We're conferring about it. We've gone back and forth once and we're trying to reach resolution on it, but we're not yet there. So if it's okay, we'll bring it back to you after lunch.
THE COURT: Perfect.
MS. COMEY: Your Honor, may I note that counsel for the victim testifying under the pseudonym Mia came back today because he in particular wants to be heard. I think he has concerns even about the limitations that your Honor was considering. He's in the courtroom, if you wouldn't mind hearing from him.
THE COURT: Of course.
MICHAEL FERRARA: Michael Ferrara, Hecker Fink for the witness testifying under the pseudonym Mia. Your Honor, two points that I wanted to make. First, I think it's unfortunate to be using cases that talk about, in large part, cooperating witnesses or sort of confidential sources in the same -- when we're applying it to victim witnesses. Your Honor knows, there's a jury instruction that your Honor -- I don't know if your Honor will give it in this case, but certainly others, where the jury is told to scrutinize a cooperator's testimony carefully. That's in sharp contrast to the way we're supposed to treat victims. It is in fact re-victimizing, at least my client, and I suspect the others, as well, to not allow them to talk about what's happening while they're going through it. Mia would have taken these things to her grave, I suspect she'll testify to that. These are the worst things that ever happened to her.
And this is my second point, the idea, which I heard your Honor saying earlier of, well, what if they can give emotional support, but not talk about the testimony. And I just wanted your Honor to understand as you rule on this how intertwined those things are. She will want emotional support about the very things. I don't know how to support her if we can't discuss the pain that she's going to experience from having to tell the world her worst secrets, the worst things that happened to her. So I just wanted to impress that upon the Court. We are not going to put words in her mouth. We will not tell her other things that happened in this courtroom, of course not, but I don't know how to respond if she wants to say something like it was gut-wrenching to say this, that, and the other thing, or am I doing okay, like, is this even coming out. Because, your Honor, candidly, her nerves are through the roof and I don't want to run afoul of your Honor's orders. So I just wanted, as your Honor thinks about these issues, I just wanted to make sure you're sort of understanding how complicated it is to un, you know, tie these ideas.
THE COURT: That's helpful. And I was just looking on the live feed of the transcript to get the quote of what you said, because I think that you -- the instruction perhaps saying substance of the testimony is too vague because you maybe have questions as to what you're permitted or not permitted to do. But what you said I think is consistent with what we're trying to prevent, which is witnesses being counseled as to how to testify or what to say or not say, and it might really be just those two things, and that otherwise the witnesses would be permitted to speak to counsel at least when we're talking about victim witnesses. Would that be sufficient guidance? So everything you said about the things you would want to talk to your client about during cross-examination, I don't think anyone here would have an issue with that. I trust any officer of the court and any counsel who comes here to follow the rules that are in place just like we've always done. And so does that provide some further guidance? Because I hear everything you're saying, and nothing that you're saying seems unreasonable.
MICHAEL FERRARA: I think it does. I think it's more the concern that we don't want to run afoul of the letter of the instruction. And I am sure Mia is going to want to say things like, how am I doing? Are you understanding this? Is it clear? Am I being clear? Things along those lines. I want to be able to answer her honestly and counsel her honestly.
THE COURT: Again, this is helpful.
MICHAEL FERRARA: If she were to say -- I mean, candidly, I worry that she might have a sort of almost, like, moment up there when she gets on the stand of, like, almost losing completely thinking, you know. And if she has, for example, if she has completely, like, left something out and she says to me, was that okay? Did it come through clearly? I would like to be able to candidly say you're doing great, I'll mention you didn't -- I think you might have forgotten or -- and maybe that's running a foul, maybe that's too far, but that would be candid counsel -- I just -- I want -- I'm so -- I can't even myself, your Honor, I have spent countless hours with her now and I worry about her emotional state up there and how that's going to work. So, again, it would not be a situation where we're saying make sure to -- make sure to say it this way, make sure to -- but if she says, how am I doing, and I know she's had a moment where she completely didn't hear a question or something along those lines, it might be something where my candid counsel, I think you misheard what the prosecutor asked you or et cetera or something like that.
THE COURT: Anything further?
MS. SHAPIRO: Your Honor, I think we'll consider that. But I just do want to point out that last example strikes me, with all due respect, understanding the sensitivities here, as going too far in the direction of coaching, to tell the witness that she, quote-unquote, left something out. I think that's exactly the purpose of this type of instruction is designed to prevent. So we'll just say that. But we'll consider what counsel has said and the instruction proposed.
THE COURT: Thank you for coming forward. Appreciate what you said and I will definitely take it into account.
MS. COMEY: Your Honor, I've just been informed counsel for the victim testifying under the pseudonym Jane would also like to be heard and is here today, if that's alright with your Honor?
THE COURT: Of course.
LINDSAY LEWIS: Good morning. I'm counsel for Jane Doe.
THE COURT: Could you please identify yourself.
LINDSAY LEWIS: Lindsay Lewis of Dratel & Lewis, counsel for Jane Doe. So I've reviewed the proposed instruction and I think it covers everything that I think is critical --
MS. COMEY: Sorry, your Honor. One moment. I don't believe an instruction has been provided to your Honor. I wanted to clarify that for the record. The parties are conferring about a proposed instruction which has been shared with counsel and --
THE COURT: Well, it's not a secret. If I asked you for it, you would give it to me now.
MS. COMEY: Yes, your Honor. I wanted to clarify for counsel.
THE COURT: Okay.
LINDSAY LEWIS: I'll reframe, your Honor. I understand there are discussions between the parties as to what a resolution might look like, all of which are issues that have already been addressed this morning in the courtroom, including critical issues as to discussions of privilege, discussions of witnesses emotional state. Particularly, I'm concerned about my own client's emotional state during her testimony. She has had very serious emotional breakdown moments in preparation for this trial. And so it is critical to me that I be able to have candid, honest, and open conversations with her throughout that process. So in that regard, while I -- I am hopeful that based on what I heard today, the nature of things that we will be able to discuss will encompass anything I'm concerned about, not just logistics and not just the emotional, but other issues such as privilege issues that might arise.
What I'm concerned about is anything that would prevent her or chill her from talking to me out of a fear that she might say something to me that would violate an understanding between the parties. And what I mean by that is if she's instructed, hey, you're allowed to talk to your counsel if you think that this -- something that you might say or that might come up might relate to a privileged issue. If she goes further than that and it runs afoul and she's afraid of that, I think it's important that her counsel, as an officer of the court, be entrusted to tell her that's not something that you can address with me, here's the scope of what we can talk about. And I think it has to be very clear and, again, not chill a victim from feeling fully open to speaking with their counsel, which they have a right to do and which, again, this idea that there's not a right to this kind of consultation is really -- there's no judicial rule or rule of, you know, it's an ad hoc thing and there's only a handful of cases even in this context that has been presented that's been granted. So I think it's very important that right of counsel be preserved.
THE COURT: So what I hear you saying, and this is consistent with what Mr. Ferrara said, is that if it needs to be clarified, it can be, but an instruction to counsel not to engage in, for instance, witness coaching or telling a witness what to say or not to say or how to say it should be sufficient because we can trust officers of this court, as we always do, to follow those rules, and if there's a violation or a perceived violation, then you would not have an issue with the witness being subject to inquiry about discussions, non-privileged discussions that they may have had during a break in cross-examination, right? That happens all the time. Is that fair?
LINDSAY LEWIS: I think that is fair. I think counsel is fully competent in this case to be able to discern the difference between content and implications, and be able to parse out what's appropriate and not, and to advise a client where the line may be, you know, we may be coming up to a line where we should stop and reframe our conversation.
THE COURT: Because what I hear you saying is that the chill comes from the Court's instruction to the witness that they are not to have discussions with their attorneys in ways that they may not fully understand and which may, from their point of view, inhibit them and cause them some of the harms that we've been talking about. But the same instruction can be made to attorneys who will understand all of those things. And I'm not hearing from you, just like I didn't hear from Mr. Ferrara, any attempt to engage in any kind of witness coaching, passing on of messages from the government to your client, any of that kind of thing, right?
LINDSAY LEWIS: That's all completely correct. Again, in particular with my client, and though I know with many people here, they never had significant interactions with the Court, and to make sure that they are comfortable to access their counsel, which is their right, is critical.
THE COURT: Ms. Comey, do we have Mr. Wigdor here, as well?
MS. COMEY: I believe we do, your Honor.
THE COURT: Mr. Wigdor, I'll hear you out, but it's going to be a simple --
DOUGLAS WIGDOR: I have nothing to add, your Honor. I have no intention of speaking to my client about anything other than logistics, healthcare, or potentially attorney-client privilege inquiries that may be made on cross-examination.
THE COURT: Ms. Comey, are there any other individuals who fall into this category?
MS. COMEY: Not that I'm aware of, your Honor.
THE COURT: Ms. Shapiro, my suggestion would be, we've now spoken to each of the attorneys who have indicated that they understand the instruction not to engage in any witness coaching, not to tell any of the witnesses what to say or what not to say, and not to talk to them about how they should or should not testify, which I think covers the category we're talking about, and I expect those three attorneys to follow that instruction. We'll add to that that they should not convey messages from the government bearing on the substance of their testimony.
MS. SHAPIRO: That was the last -- I was just going to say, your Honor, I would ask you to direct them not to confer with the government about the substance of the testimony and only, if necessary, as to logistics.
MS. COMEY: Your Honor, I can represent as an officer of the court that I have never done something like that and our team would never do anything like that. You can be assured of that.
THE COURT: Now we have four attorneys who have made the appropriate representation. I think we've now covered the waterfront. If there's a violation, we will address it. Similar to what happened in the Avenatti case, if there's any perception that there have been discussions or may have been discussions, the classic example is when someone comes back from a break and says they want to clarify something and it seems a little peculiar, there of course can be inquiry into those subjects with the witness, subject to any privilege issues of course. But we've all taken depositions, we all know how to deal with this. This happens from time to time. We can do these things and make that inquiry and handle it that way. So that's how we will handle it. So that takes care of that issue. Now, as to defense discovery, I had some --
MS. GERAGOS: We're putting together our response, your Honor.
THE COURT: Here's the issue. There are certainly cases going in both directions. I'd say the vast majority of cases have adopted what I take to be the government's view, that case in chief is not just a timing issue, it's the purpose for which you're conducting discovery. And so to the extent that you are introducing affirmative evidence during a cross-examination that is not to refresh a witness's recollection and not for impeachment purposes and that counts as being within the case in chief. However, the way the rule is structured is that the defendant's obligations only are triggered if they have requested discovery from the government, meaning that there's a trade that's made, and then the defendant has to be eyes wide open as to what the trade is. No discussion, as I take it, was had in this case as to what that meant in terms of the defendant's discovery; is that fair?
MS. GERAGOS: That's fair.
THE COURT: So that discussion wasn't had in the context of Rule 16 and also wasn't had in the context of --
MS. COMEY: I'm not sure I understand what discussion your Honor is talking about.
THE COURT: I'm saying the government has already turned over its Rule 16 discovery.
MS. COMEY: 100 percent and our marked exhibits.
THE COURT: So some of the cases that have taken what is the minority position have indicated even if the majority position is correct, the issue is timing of a different kind. If, in advance of the Rule 16 exchange of discovery, there was an acknowledgement or an understanding that the defense discovery that would be triggered would include affirmative evidence that was put in on cross-examination, then I think I would agree with the government that that would be fairly encompassed because that's part of the deal, that's what was discussed, that's what's understood. But there's no binding authority as to this issue because it's all district court cases. And I'll grant you that, as far as I can tell, it is in the Southern District, in the Eastern District and around the nation, it is the majority position, but it is still not the confirmed rule and it has some tension with the language of the rule. So given that none of these discussions happened, why is it -- it seems to me, in fairness, to not really be a Rule 16 issue, meaning not an issue where, by operation of the rule, the defendant is in violation and has to immediately turn over the documents or is subject to preclusion or any of the other remedies, right?
MS. COMEY: Your Honor, every single discovery letter we have sent to defense counsel in this case has started with in light of your request for discovery, and has ended with, in light of your request for discovery, we request reciprocal discovery, and that is a long string cite. So I think this has been --
THE COURT: Do those letters make clear that that would include any evidence that would be put in during cross-examination as opposed to just a general reference to the defendant's case in chief?
MS. COMEY: I would need to check those letters, your Honor, but I believe the clear intention of those letters, which are standard for our office in every case, is to trigger precisely this reciprocal obligation. And I think that the spirit of that was also carried through in the parties' negotiation of a period to turn over exhibits in advance of trial. It is meaningless to receive four exhibits in advance of trial. It is only meaningful that that deadline that the parties agreed on is only meaningful if it includes all of the exhibits that would be used affirmatively to prove a defense, including on cross-examination.
THE COURT: I agree with that. That's why I would have hoped this was raised in advance of trial. Ms. Geragos, you are standing.
MS. GERAGOS: I have to respond to this point because they've been using terms. They asked for reciprocal Rule 16 discovery. We have provided that to the government on the date that it was ordered, things that they did not have, that they did not provide to us, that they theoretically could have gotten, but they didn't. We provided that on the date that we were ordered to do so. Everything that we have marked otherwise has been stuff that the government gave us in discovery productions in November and December of this year. To now have to be ordered to give those over prior to our cross-examination, it shows our strategy. It's nothing that they haven't seen before because they have it, but for us to have to --
THE COURT: This is not a Rule 16 issue.
MS. GERAGOS: It's a strategy issue.
THE COURT: You would agree that, as a matter of normal case management, many judges, not even talking about Rule 16, have requirements on turning over documents that are going to be used, like exhibits that are going to be used of some nature, right?
MS. GERAGOS: We have been ordered in every trial, in every federal trial we've ever done, we have an exhibit deadline, of course, yes. When it comes to cross-examination, to have to give those over prior to the direct finishing, that's something we have fought consistently in every case since I've been admitted to this district and Eastern District, because it's also just not practical because we just don't know what's going -- we don't know what we are going to use affirmatively because we don't know how the direct is going to go. This direct in particular has gone much differently than I expected. So we are kind of changing our strategy. So to now give over things before it completes, before lunch hours and times when they can go over this with the witness, it defeats the purpose of cross-examination. But yes, I understand, as a matter of judicial economy, the Court would like to have these.
THE COURT: It's not a like. You acknowledge that it is done, like it is --
MS. GERAGOS: We've complied with what we knew we would use. We just don't know what we are using in every cross.
THE COURT: No, I understand that. We may be arguing about a very small category of documents is my suspicion. But regardless of that, is there some issue, as you're getting into cross-examination with the witness, let's say that you had evidence that you may use the following day, would there be any issue in turning that over to the government by 6:00 p.m. the day before so they could see what you're planning to use?
MS. GERAGOS: Of course we will do that.
THE COURT: That's just a practical matter.
MS. GERAGOS: If we have it marked and know we're going to use it by 6:00 p.m., I mean, we get things late.
THE COURT: No, you'll just have to do it by 6:00 p.m. if you're planning on introducing something the next day. The reason for that, putting aside Rule 16, the reason for that is that if it's not going to be used to refresh a witness's recollection or for impeachment purposes, something of that kind, then we need some notice so if there is an evidentiary objection, it does not need to be addressed when the jury is in, the take a sidebar to comb through evidence and redact certain things and do all the things that the parties have been doing with respect to the remainder of the evidence. The issue, it's not a strategy issue at that point, it's just an issue of let's have a seamless presentation of the evidence, and it's not giving the government that much time to do anything with these documents. They're going to be trying to go through whatever exhibits you happen to give them to determine whether there's any evidentiary issue that they need to resolve.
MS. GERAGOS: I think for this week, your Honor, 6:00 p.m. would be very difficult given we go until 5:00 and have not made it back to our office until 6:00 p.m., and then there's discussion of what we would try to introduce the next day. Or the remainder of the trial, we could absolutely make 6:00 p.m. happen so long as the government -- if the direct is done.
THE COURT: Okay. All right. I'm going to think about this, as well. Ms. Johnson, can you give us a ballpark estimate on how much we have left on direct?
MS. JOHNSON: I suspect that I need at least sort of the next 90 minutes until the first break and perhaps a little bit after that, but I imagine being complete with the direct examination at some point after lunch, but before the end of the day.
(Continued on next page)
THE COURT: All right. Ms. Comey, I think you were going to get up. I'm happy to hear any useful suggestion you have.
MS. COMEY: Just, I anticipate this being an issue later in the trial, that there will be witnesses whose direct finishes and then there is no break and we go right into cross. And so, if the defense is going to insist on not giving us those exhibits, exhibits they may seek to introduce for those witnesses, before their direct is done, I'm concerned we are going to have delays.
THE COURT: Do you have an issue with the proposal, which is that if you're going to use it the next day, it has to be turned over. If there is a chance, we should know that, at the end of every day. We always talk about what is going to happen the next day.
MS. COMEY: Yes, your Honor. I didn't mean to interrupt.
THE COURT: No, you're fine.
MS. COMEY: I think that this is reasonable and I think the government has been making similar efforts on our end to preview for the defense what of our many marked exhibits we intend to introduce the next day. I think that be fair.
THE COURT: Again, you're not talking about impeachment, you're not talking about things might be used along those lines.
MS. COMEY: 100 percent, your Honor.
THE COURT: So the strategy concern is diminished. If you're try to attack a witness' credibility, we are not talking about that.
MS. COMEY: That's exactly right, your Honor. In theory, the defense could wait to put in any of the exhibits until we rest. If they decide strategically that they want to try to start proving up their defense during our cross-examinations, then they have to produce the exhibits in advance. If they want to hold them back and only introduce them on their defense case, that is a strategic decision they could make.
THE COURT: Understood. Again, if this issue came up prior to the Rule 16 disclosures and everything, then we would have addressed this. I would be facing cases from around the nation that say that it's not just a timing issue, it actually applies during cross-examination. But we are here.
MS. COMEY: I understand, your Honor. I want to apologize for not flagging the issue earlier.
THE COURT: No. Everything is happening all at once, all the time. I understand. Ms. Geragos, any last words, and then I'll think about this and I'll give some guidance when we come back.
MR. AGNIFILO: The one thing I want to make clear, this is the fourth time we've had this exact same discussion and it's resolved itself a few different ways. With the trial in front of Judge Garaufis, we gave everything that we had over as soon as the direct ended. That was fine. We had another trial in that case. The prosecutors in that trial said, if you give it to us early, we will assure you, and there is no -- the court can't get involved in this. We assure you, party to party, we won't prep the witness on it. So what we did there is we gave it to them early because we trusted them. So, there is different --
THE COURT: Do you trust them here?
MR. AGNIFILO: I do. If they say they won't prep the witness, I believe them 100 percent. But to their credit, they are not saying that because they are honest. So, we can work this out. I want to take this off the court's plate, and I will. We will work this out. Because I don't think -- it's a fascinating issue. I think there is constitutional issues of burdens of proof that we can avoid. Like, we're supposed to avoid tricky constitutional issues. We will work this out, and I will be the one to make sure we work it out.
THE COURT: All right. Well, so, resolved. But if it's not resolved, let's address this sooner than later. I mean, today. If you're going to come to an agreement on this, let's do it before the end of the day so that we can make sure that we are in a good place by close of business. Otherwise, I think we have already discussed, as to Ms. Ventura, what is going to happen, which is, Mr. Agnifilo, before cross-examination, those, all the exhibits will be turned over.
MR. AGNIFILO: Yes. I have one quick question for the government. Just for a second.
(Counsel confer)
MR. AGNIFILO: I understand. I had a logistical question, which I have now answered.
THE COURT: All right. We will come back at the time that I indicated, which was what? I said 1:15. It is 1:15. How much time do you all need to get something to eat?
MR. AGNIFILO: 15 minutes, Judge.
(Counsel confer)
THE COURT: It's all right.
MS. JOHNSON: We also have to print the binders.
THE COURT: All right.
MS. ESTEVAO: The live feed is not operating. We would request time for that.
THE COURT: 1:45? Let's come back at 1:45.
(Luncheon recess)
THE COURT: P5EsCOM3
AFTERNOON SESSION 1:45 p.m.
(Jury not present)
THE COURT: Please be seated. As to Exhibit 619, the version, the objection to the defendant's proposal under Rule 106 is overruled, subject to the discussion that we had in terms of which pages would come in. So, just for the sake of the record, my understanding is that it is 706 through 708, is that correct, Ms. Geragos?
MS. GERAGOS: Yes, it is, your Honor.
THE COURT: So then we'll handle that exhibit in that fashion. Other than that, is there anything else we need to address before we bring in the witness and the jury?
MS. JOHNSON: Your Honor, I just wanted to flag how we will proceed with the sealed exhibits. We have hard copy material for the defendant and for the court, and we are able to show it on the screens just for the jury and the witness, in order to keep that material within the well of the courtroom and not visible.
THE COURT: That's fine. These are not videos, these are the images?
MS. JOHNSON: These are the images.
THE COURT: Are there videos that are going to be used in the witness?
MS. JOHNSON: The government does not intend to use any videos with the witness. I understand the defense may, and we have requested to confer after the trial day about how that might happen.
THE COURT: That would require headphones.
MS. JOHNSON: Headphones, and we will have to address how the video will be shown to counsel.
THE COURT: Anything else from the government?
MS. JOHNSON: No, your Honor.
THE COURT: Anything from the defense?
MR. AGNIFILO: No, your Honor.
THE COURT: Let's have Ms. Ventura back, and then we'll bring in our jury. Welcome back.
CASANDRA VENTURA: Thank you.
(Continued on next page)
(Jury present)
THE COURT: All rise. Please be seated. Welcome back, members of the jury. I know it was an extended lunch break, but I assure you, while you were hopefully relaxing, we were working hard to make things more efficient so we can save your time. With that, Ms. Ventura, you understand you're still under oath?
THE COURT: Ms. Johnson, you may proceed.
MS. JOHNSON: Thank you, your Honor. May I approach the bench with a binder for the court?
THE COURT: You may.
MS. JOHNSON: Just to confirm, before I proceed, my understanding is that the feed, the exhibit feed to the overflow room has been turned off and that the public, the monitor that faces the gallery, has also been turned off.
THE COURT: All right. That is confirmed. If anyone views anything on any of those screens or if anyone is aware of that not being the case or any material going to the overflow room, they should alert me immediately.
COURT CLERK: Your Honor, that is largely correct. They cannot see the evidence in any capacity. They will just see the camera feeds. Nothing else.
THE COURT: That's the overhead view?
COURT CLERK: That is correct, and the witness stand.
THE COURT: All right. So, given that we're using binders, everyone should just be mindful there is an overhead camera on the witness, on the counsel tables. Ms. Johnson, you may proceed.
MS. JOHNSON: Thank you, your Honor.
BY MS. JOHNSON: